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  1. #1
    Big Traveler SouthTX's Avatar
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    337RLS Tow weights & GVWR Calculation

    New guy here. We're shopping for a 337RLS and I'm having to sharpen my pencil to see if my current 2016 F250 6.2l tow vehicle will be adequate. I just turned 10,000 miles on it and I'd like to wait a model year or so before I swap it for a diesel.

    From what I've read on this forum, others are using similar trucks with no problem, but the hitch and payload numbers are so close that I've been a little uneasy.

    My yellow sticker payload is 3209 and the reports I've read are of 337RL pin weights in the range of 2600 to 2800. Based on the cargo weight of my soon to be former fiver, I should be in that same range. So I can live with this hitch weight, but not much margin for error.

    When I checked my door stickers, I noticed that my GVWR is 10,000, but my axle ratings total 10,650. Then it dawned on me that the manufacturers' 10,000 GVWR is only a paperwork thing and my sticker payload is 10,000 less the actual weight of the vehicle. IOW, the manufacturer derates the vehicle on paper so as to fall in a lower class for the purpose of tax and registration. (I always wondered what the purpose was of the optional 10,000 weight rating.)

    Am I correct in thinking that my actual (lets call it) design payload is the total axle weight ratings (rather than GVWR) less the vehicle weight? If so, my design payload is 3,859 and the 337RLS pin weight will be well within the axle and tire ratings of the truck.
    My actual weight should be about 1,000 lbs under the max rated towing capacity of my current TV and I'm a flat land guy so I think I'll be OK, there.

    If my thinking is correct, then the F250's with the camper package are rated the same as the F350 SRW, which will greatly simplify TV shopping when the time comes as there are a lot more F250's to choose from.

    Any comments from those who have been there and towed with this configuration would be appreciated. Can I live with this truck for another year pulling a 337RL?

  2. #2
    Long Hauler LCBoyer's Avatar
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    I think you can live with your setup. Make sure truck tires are good and properly inflated.
    2018 Freedom Elite 24FE, 2 Yorkies, and my wife MARILYN, HAM call K0LCB. Traveling around this great country, making friends and seeing lot of beautiful and interesting places

  3. #3
    Long Hauler Paul & Deb's Avatar
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    I just had my 337 weighed at the Owner's Rally and it came in at 13,700 lbs! Just short of the GVW. My pin weight was 3,400 lbs. Yup, you read that right. These things are heavy and not really in 3/4 ton territory. I originally towed with a 3/4 ton and moved up to a 1 ton due to the weight.

    Now, I must add that I was not comfortable with the weights the guy from RVSEF (RV Weighing & Safety Education) provided. I think his scales were out of wack but I previously weighed it and the trailer weighed 13,550 and the pin was 3,100 so either way, it's better towed by a 1 ton.

    BTW, as I said I did tow this trailer with my previous 3/4 ton truck for nearly 2 years without difficulty but it was still well over it's labeled limits.
    Paul "Poppy" and Deb Cervone
    2022 Imagine XLS 22MLE
    2021 Imagine XLS 17MKE - SOLD ; 2015 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS - SOLD
    2016 GMC Denali 3500HD SRW Duramax/Allison CC 4x4; Tire Minder TPMS

  4. #4
    Site Team Second Chance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Poppy's 5th Wheel View Post
    I just had my 337 weighed at the Owner's Rally and it came in at 13,700 lbs! Just short of the GVW. My pin weight was 3,400 lbs. Yup, you read that right. These things are heavy and not really in 3/4 ton territory. I originally towed with a 3/4 ton and moved up to a 1 ton due to the weight.

    Now, I must add that I was not comfortable with the weights the guy from RVSEF (RV Weighing & Safety Education) provided. I think his scales were out of wack but I previously weighed it and the trailer weighed 13,550 and the pin was 3,100 so either way, it's better towed by a 1 ton.

    BTW, as I said I did tow this trailer with my previous 3/4 ton truck for nearly 2 years without difficulty but it was still well over it's labeled limits.
    X2^^. Our pin weight is consistently in the 3,000 - 3,200 lb. range (Paul keeps livestock in his basement...). By the time you load fuel, people, hitch and junk in the truck, you will be over the rear axle ratings with a 337 - and close if not at the rear tire ratings on the truck. Consider the 303 or move up to a 1-ton SRW. We moved to a 1-ton DRW when we had the chance of a lifetime and are SO much happier. The issue with any 3/4-ton truck is not whether or not the truck will pull the trailer, but rather the truck's payload for the pin weight (although there is a HUGE difference between diesel and gas on any kind of a grade).

    Rob
    U.S. Army Retired
    2012 F350 DRW CC LB Lariat PS 6.7
    2020 Solitude 310GK-R, MORryde IS, disc brakes,
    Sailun LRG tires, solar, DP windows, W/D
    (Previously in a Reflection 337RLS)
    Full time since 08/2015

  5. #5
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    2017 F-250 4x4 Lariat SC SB gasser,.2018 337 no washer dryer, no water in tanks, need a few more tools though. Just got back to Augusta Ga from a week long tripGatlinburg TN, full fuel, wife dog and all the stuff from the outlet malls.
    Cat scales showed:
    4120 steer axle
    5660 drive axle
    9180 trailer axle
    18960 combined gross
    Calculated pin wight about 2650 (app. 22%)

    Facts:
    Well under all payload requirements, pulled and stopped great averaging 9.1 running 65 or less round trip.
    Would a diesel pull better? Yes, but they're so much heavier you will be over the payload with a 250 diesel.
    350 diesel will get a little better mileage than a gasser however in the east where i live gasoline is generally 15% cheaper per gallon.
    Diesel will be worth more after 10 or 15 years but it's not worth it to me for the added upkeep, additional up front cost etc..
    own shifted to 2nd once uphill and once downhill coming through N.C before i turned off the cruise control.

    Opinion:
    Bottom line is check the door sticker for actual payload, weigh the trailer regularly and load sensibly and you should have no problem.

    Terry

  6. #6
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    P.S.
    Door sticker shows 10000 GVW, 3340 payload, 6340 rer axle gross, 4120 ft axle gross

  7. #7
    Big Traveler SouthTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Second Chance View Post
    X2^^. Our pin weight is consistently in the 3,000 - 3,200 lb. range (Paul keeps livestock in his basement...). By the time you load fuel, people, hitch and junk in the truck, you will be over the rear axle ratings with a 337 - and close if not at the rear tire ratings on the truck. Consider the 303 or move up to a 1-ton SRW. We moved to a 1-ton DRW when we had the chance of a lifetime and are SO much happier. The issue with any 3/4-ton truck is not whether or not the truck will pull the trailer, but rather the truck's payload for the pin weight (although there is a HUGE difference between diesel and gas on any kind of a grade).

    Rob
    Wow, are you guys selling bricks or just like to carry a full set of barbells? <G> Full-timers?

    My soon-to-be-former 30' fiver is loaded with 1,300 lbs of cargo. The GD website lists the 337RLS empty weight as 10,570. If this weight is close to actual and I can keep the DW's hoarding instincts under control, that would give me a pin weight <2,500 lbs. This would put me a couple of hundred pounds under the sticker payload (based on the manufacturer's (derated) GVWR), just without much margin or room for growth. OTOH, if I can safely use the axle weight ratings as my safe limit, that would leave me a comfortable margin.

    What I'm seeing - if I'm reading it all correctly - is that the F250 w/camper package is functionally the same vehicle as the SRW F350. When I look at the towing guide, they have the same tow limits for the same engine/rear end.

    Can anyone enlighten me on the significance of a derated GVRW?

  8. #8
    Site Team Second Chance's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthTX View Post
    Can anyone enlighten me on the significance of a derated GVRW?
    If it's truly just de-rated and there are no mechanical differences, it's all a matter of taxes and registration and what your insurance might or might not cover should you get into trouble.

    Rob
    U.S. Army Retired
    2012 F350 DRW CC LB Lariat PS 6.7
    2020 Solitude 310GK-R, MORryde IS, disc brakes,
    Sailun LRG tires, solar, DP windows, W/D
    (Previously in a Reflection 337RLS)
    Full time since 08/2015

  9. #9
    Big Traveler SouthTX's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TLB923 View Post
    2017 F-250 4x4 Lariat SC SB gasser,.2018 337 no washer dryer, no water in tanks, need a few more tools though. Just got back to Augusta Ga from a week long tripGatlinburg TN, full fuel, wife dog and all the stuff from the outlet malls.
    Cat scales showed:
    4120 steer axle
    5660 drive axle
    9180 trailer axle
    18960 combined gross
    Calculated pin wight about 2650 (app. 22%)

    Facts:
    Well under all payload requirements, pulled and stopped great averaging 9.1 running 65 or less round trip.
    Would a diesel pull better? Yes, but they're so much heavier you will be over the payload with a 250 diesel.
    350 diesel will get a little better mileage than a gasser however in the east where i live gasoline is generally 15% cheaper per gallon.
    Diesel will be worth more after 10 or 15 years but it's not worth it to me for the added upkeep, additional up front cost etc..
    own shifted to 2nd once uphill and once downhill coming through N.C before i turned off the cruise control.

    Opinion:
    Bottom line is check the door sticker for actual payload, weigh the trailer regularly and load sensibly and you should have no problem.

    Terry
    I hear you about needing more tools. After all, they can always be moved to the rear of the RV to take weight off the pin. <G>

    Your real world experience (and scale numbers) make me feel much better. (Except your gas mileage is much better than mine - I get around 8.5 running 63, less with a headwind.) I think perhaps the yellow sticker payloads are deceptive when the optional 10,000 package is installed. The extra 400 to 600 lbs of payload gained by using the axle weights is pretty significant when a fifthwheel is involved.

  10. #10
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    MPG surprised me too. Drive to Gatlinburg, mainly surface streets 50MPH and lower average MPG was 9.6, back to August mostly Interstate at ~65MPH dropped to 8.7.
    Planning to mount an aluminum tool box on the rear for a few additional tools, 20T jack, extra blocking etc. Truck is rated for 12600 max trailer so I've got over 800 "legal" pounds left there.
    In my experience, capacities assigned by the manufacturer are generally pretty conservative. I never paid attention to the door stickers 'til now (older and wiser now?), if it pulled it and stopped it and didn't drag the rear bumper it was fine.

    BTW, with 2650 hitch weight the truck only dropped 3" (measured on level pavement) at the center line of the rear wheel.

    Also, we love the 337, a few minor issues, fixed myself. Flat tire, screw in the sidewall probably from MFR or dealer lot, Lionshead is shipping a new tire. Madison RV near Huntsville AL pulled the hubs and checked the brakes and seals in their PDI even though the axles were dated 6/17.
    Regards and happy camping!

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