Swapping tires

[BigGuy82]

H

I traded my Westlakes for similar spec Maxxis tires. The best option in 15” tires before Goodyear Endurance came into the market. The Maxxis ST E spec tires each weigh about the same as the Westlake tires. I have nearly as many miles on the Maxxis tires and they are wearing just as well as the Westlakes.

Rob

Rob,

Don't know much about Maxxis, but I'll be posting an update when I swap out my Westlake spare for a Sailun in the near future. When I refused delivery on my Solitude due to the Westlake failure and insisted on Sailuns, GD wouldn't budge but the dealer bit the bullet - on six tires. I still don't feel good about the spare, so that's going before we head out for FL and AL in January. I will weigh both tires and post it here - both will be the same size and G rating. However, I'm sure you've seen the weight comparisons between Goodyears and Sailuns vs Westlake on this forum, telling me that these brands are a more substantial tire than the Westlakes. Another consideration is that Sailun and Goodyear both have experience building heavy truck tires and I'm sure lessons learned there carry over to their ST lines. To the best of my knowledge, Westlake only does car and RV tires.

Dick

[Kevin2282]

I did not have good luck with the 15” Maxxis M8008 E Range
tires on my previous travel trailer. I switched to Carlisle Radial Trail HD E Range two years ago and they are doing reall good.

[Leon T]

I haven't had the best luck with Maxxis or Carlisle. Used them on flat bed and horse trailers. Maxxis so crappy that I resorted to using bias ply tires on one of my horse trailers. At least they don't explode, they just go flat.

My experience with the Westlake tires tells me that I'd use them for 2 years and then get rid of them.

[Canyonlight]

H

Dick (BigGuy82) . . . we have to “agree to disagree” on this. You have no real evidence of why the Westlake tire failed before you took delivery of your rig. Maybe this tire left the factory at way under spec pressure? I had 3 years and 11,000 problem free miles on my Westlake tires. That is my “fact”.

You have a “heavy” trailer . . . I have a “light” one. This is probably a significant difference.

I traded my Westlakes for similar spec Maxxis tires. The best option in 15” tires before Goodyear Endurance came into the market. The Maxxis ST E spec tires each weigh about the same as the Westlake tires. I have nearly as many miles on the Maxxis tires and they are wearing just as well as the Westlakes.

Most of the thousands of GDRV trailers on the road today are travelling on their OEM Westlake tires. You can disagree with the manufacturer’s claimed 1/2% failure rate, but there is no way to prove/disprove this claim. Westlake sells so many tires across all types of trailers that 1/2% is still thousands of failed tires. I have never seen failure claims by other tire manufacturers, but I expect that they are not much less than 1/2% . . . just a much lower sales volume.

Rob

Rob - well said. The facts surrounding what really caused the tire issues is the unknown and the challenge. Even one instance of a tire being run with less air than necessary to carry the load or impacts from curbs/road hazards/etc. can compromise the tire integrity.

Being concerned about Westlakes was something many of us communicated on years ago due to the old history out there prior to the current generation of Westlakes manufactured in the last 6 or so years. We learned from many sources that the concerns were unfounded with the current generation.

While the number of issues reported gets attention (as with any major item) the % is extremely low. With a significant number of manufacturers using Westlakes I suspect that there are multi millions of Westlake RV tires in use. For Sailuns (and GY Endrance since so new) probably several thousands. Yes, the reports have been positive and that is encouraging.

We have also learned over the last several years that many RV manufacturers have been installing tires that just meet or may not be sufficient to carry the RV load at times. A number of failures regardless of brand fall ino this category. GDRV has taken notice and tires with greater load capacities are being done at build to have a better safety margin and prevent failures.

The "tire tenacity" by some is admirable. However caution needs to be excercised to not create unwarranted concerns for many owners W/O having all the facts.

Dan

[BigGuy82]

While the number of issues reported gets attention (as with any major item) the % is extremely low.

Dan

I'm not going to belabor the same points all over again. Just one point regarding your response - I have a triple and a 1 in 27.5 failure rate is not "extremely low" for a safety critical part. It is lousy, and allowing mediocrity in tires is not a good practice. Grand Design and some forum members keep saying it's low, but it's not, especially since the reported failures all seem to be catastrophic. So as to not bore our members with the same data that has been previously posted, I'd be glad to provide the math behind this vie email.

So, enough said by me until the next catastrophic failure of a Westlake, at which point I will once again chime in.

[Cate&Rob]

An important piece of information in this discussion (that we don’t have) is the failure rate for tires other than Westlake. The LionsHead reps speak about their 1/2% (one in 200) failure rate in terms that indicate that they are very proud of this number.

In post 7 of this earlier thread https://www.mygrandrv.com/fo...d-Design/page3 I linked NHTSA data on passenger cars that showed tire failures across all tire brands was many times this number. I was unable to find any NHTSA data on trailer tires.

If someone could find trailer tire failure data for other manufacturers . . . this whole discussion would make a lot more sense.

Rob

[bertschb]

If someone could find trailer tire failure data for other manufacturers . . . this whole discussion would make a lot more sense.

I think this is the challenge. Nobody here really has any hard data. Most of us are getting our information from forums. Not a bad source, but certainly not scientific. From the rather extensive searching I've done, here are my own observations...

Westlake E rated - What I would consider a "significant" number of reported (catastrophic) failures
Westlake G rated - I've only read of one failure but these haven't been used in large numbers until recently
Sailun S637 - Glowing reviews and I've yet to run across a failure
Goodyear G614 - Again, glowing reviews. Some failures from ten plus years ago but nothing in the past few years
Goodyear Endurance E rated - Good reviews with no failures but a very new tire

Again, these are just my observations from all the searching I've done. YMMV! I think the biggest problem with this forum is 90% of the tires in use by Grand Design owners are Westlake E rated because that's all GD used (with the exception of optional G614 for a short time) for the first few years. Because of that, there are far more of them out there so even if all the tires I mentioned above had the same failure rate, we should expect to see far more failures of the Westlake E rated tires.

This whole tire thing is driving me crazy. Since tires are at the top of my list of important safety gear, I want the best and I don't care about the cost. My new Solitude will ship with Westlake G rated tires. I read that they are considered a G614 clone and are built very well but they are so new we just don't have much data on them. The G614 was my first choice for our Reflection but the Solitude is much heaver and the G614 only has a load index rating of 126 (3,748lbs). The Westlake G tires are rated at 4,079lbs. The S637 in the 235/85R16 size is rated at 4,409lbs. I hate to replace the G rated Westlakes when they may be a great tire but I think that's what I'm going to do. I'm probably going with the S637. If Goodyear made a G614 with a 132 load index rating like the Sailun, I'd buy them in a heartbeat.

Sorry my posts have drifted away from the OP topic...

[BigGuy82]

I think this is the challenge. Nobody here really has any hard data. Most of us are getting our information from forums. Not a bad source, but certainly not scientific. From the rather extensive searching I've done, here are my own observations...

Westlake E rated - What I would consider a "significant" number of reported (catastrophic) failures
Westlake G rated - I've only read of one failure but these haven't been used in large numbers until recently
Sailun S637 - Glowing reviews and I've yet to run across a failure
Goodyear G614 - Again, glowing reviews. Some failures from ten plus years ago but nothing in the past few years
Goodyear Endurance E rated - Good reviews with no failures but a very new tire

Again, these are just my observations from all the searching I've done. YMMV! I think the biggest problem with this forum is 90% of the tires in use by Grand Design owners are Westlake E rated because that's all GD used (with the exception of optional G614 for a short time) for the first few years. Because of that, there are far more of them out there so even if all the tires I mentioned above had the same failure rate, we should expect to see far more failures of the Westlake E rated tires.

This whole tire thing is driving me crazy. Since tires are at the top of my list of important safety gear, I want the best and I don't care about the cost. My new Solitude will ship with Westlake G rated tires. I read that they are considered a G614 clone and are built very well but they are so new we just don't have much data on them. The G614 was my first choice for our Reflection but the Solitude is much heaver and the G614 only has a load index rating of 126 (3,748lbs). The Westlake G tires are rated at 4,079lbs. The S637 in the 235/85R16 size is rated at 4,409lbs. I hate to replace the G rated Westlakes when they may be a great tire but I think that's what I'm going to do. I'm probably going with the S637. If Goodyear made a G614 with a 132 load index rating like the Sailun, I'd buy them in a heartbeat.

Sorry my posts have drifted away from the OP topic...

My Solitude had 235/80R16 Westlake G tires on it. The center left blew in less than 500 miles - couldn't make it from the factory to the dealer. After refusing delivery, the dealer replaced with Sailuns in the same size as the originals. Have had Sailuns on two fivers with over 25,000 combined and never had a problem. Your money, your choice.

PS - ALWAYS run them at 110 PSI.

[bertschb]

@BigGuy82 -

Your Westlake G failure is the only one I've read about. Having said that, I'm 90% sure I'm going with Sailun's. Just trying to figure out who will mount them if I buy them online. Our local Les Schwab tire store wants $854 for the tires. SimpleTire wants $614 delivered.

[BigGuy82]

@BigGuy82 -

Your Westlake G failure is the only one I've read about. Having said that, I'm 90% sure I'm going with Sailun's. Just trying to figure out who will mount them if I buy them online. Our local Les Schwab tire store wants $854 for the tires. SimpleTire wants $614 delivered.

If the $854 is for four tires with mounting and balancing, that ain't bad. However, it doesn't matter where you get them as long as the install is good. I would mount them on the trailer myself if I were you. Most tire shops, RV service centers and truck service centers should be able to mount them on your rims. Also, a lot of online tire outlets have "certified installers" that they will send the tires to for mounting. Also, I am a proponent of Centramatic Balancers - you might want to check them out.

By the way, good luck with the new Solitude - we absolutely love ours! I hope you enjoy yours at least as much as we enjoy ours! I also see you bought a new truck - I'm jealous! The one you bought is a beauty!