Seems I'm buying everything backwards.

[Rovers]

I once saw a race up a long mountain incline between a F150 with 2.7 Ecoboost and a Ram 1500 with the Ecodiesel. Both were pulling an enclosed trailer with identical 5000 lb. weights. The 2.7 Ecoboost easily pulled away from the Ecodiesel. The difference in fuel costs would be negligible when you consider the diesel's required maintenance costing more.

You didn't say what kind of hitch you were going to be using on the Imagine trailer. I once had a 32' travel trailer, and a famous brand equalizer hitch with 1000 lb. bars and the friction style antisway. I often was quite scared when a tractor trailer truck passed me going very fast--about blowing me into the next lane. Today, I'd be going for one of the nicer, more high tech hitches like a Blue Ox or comparable hitches providing greater stability.

I don't want to hijack this thread but as an owner of a Ram Ecodiesel I thought I'd give some real world info...

1) The common comment about higher diesel maintenance costs in my experience is a myth, especially with the 1/2 ton diesels. I do two oil changes a year at 12,000 mile intervals and it costs me about $75 each time. I do the changes myself so yes, I save a couple of bucks that way. But when you consider that the recommended interval in a gasser that tows regularly is no more than 5000 to 6000 miles the diesel is no worse than even-Steven with a gasser if not a little bit ahead. The Ecoboost requires synthetic oil too and it costs nearly the same as synthetic for a diesel. Also, Ford recommends at least 89 octane if not 91 octane when towing so the fuel cost to tow with a diesel is LESS than a Ford running the higher octane. Most stations price mid-level gas the same as diesel whereas premium gas is quite a bit more than diesel.

DEF fluid costs about $10/jug at Autozone and I go 10,000 miles between top-offs so let's call that $15 a year. I don't do tune-ups (no spark plugs or other "tuning" required), I change the air filter at the same interval as a gasser and change the fuel filter every 30,000 miles for $25. A diesel is NOT expensive to maintain.

2) NOBODY races up a mountain with a 5000 pound trailer in tow. That Ecoboost engine would be screaming at 6000 rpm or so while spinning TWO turbochargers and building huge heat in each of them at those RPM's. Meanwhile the Ecodiesel would be sitting at 2500 rpm getting better fuel economy while doing so comfortably. Torque is king when towing - horsepower is nice for racing but doesn't help you much when pulling a heavy load.

My day-to-day driving yields me 24 mpg's in a mix of city/highway/country roads. On the highway I regularly see 27 to 29 mpg's when not towing. On a recent camping trip from home in NE Ohio to Nashville and back - a mix of flat central Ohio to very hilly Kentucky and Tennessee - I averaged 13.2 mpg running between 65 and 68 mph. That's nearly twice the fuel mileage an Ecoboost would get on the same trip. And on the longer climbs up the Kentucky and Tennessee hills the transmission rarely downshifted leaving my RPM's at around 2200. Very comfortable.

Now, is the comfort and ease of towing with a diesel worth it vs a gasser? Is the added initial cost of a diesel worth it? That's a personal call but I can say from my own experience that I will never go back to towing with a gasser. The diesel just makes it effortless and the way the manufacturers are pricing the 1/2 ton diesels they are within just a few hundred dollars of the large V-8's offered in the trucks. Worth it to me.

Here's the mileage from a recent 760 mile trip from Ohio to Central PA and back (not towing) on ONE tank of fuel. Certainly not flat from Eastern Ohio along I-80 to Central PA. Didn't have to pay exorbitant fuel prices in Pennsylvania - I filled up when I got home.



I've said my peace. Back to the original thread....

Bob

[iproff1]

I don't want to hijack this thread but as an owner of a Ram Ecodiesel I thought I'd give some real world info...

1) The common comment about higher diesel maintenance costs in my experience is a myth, especially with the 1/2 ton diesels. I do two oil changes a year at 12,000 mile intervals and it costs me about $75 each time. I do the changes myself so yes, I save a couple of bucks that way. But when you consider that the recommended interval in a gasser that tows regularly is no more than 5000 to 6000 miles the diesel is no worse than even-Steven with a gasser if not a little bit ahead. The Ecoboost requires synthetic oil too and it costs nearly the same as synthetic for a diesel. Also, Ford recommends at least 89 octane if not 91 octane when towing so the fuel cost to tow with a diesel is LESS than a Ford running the higher octane. Most stations price mid-level gas the same as diesel whereas premium gas is quite a bit more than diesel.

DEF fluid costs about $10/jug at Autozone and I go 10,000 miles between top-offs so let's call that $15 a year. I don't do tune-ups (no spark plugs or other "tuning" required), I change the air filter at the same interval as a gasser and change the fuel filter every 30,000 miles for $25. A diesel is NOT expensive to maintain.

2) NOBODY races up a mountain with a 5000 pound trailer in tow. That Ecoboost engine would be screaming at 6000 rpm or so while spinning TWO turbochargers and building huge heat in each of them at those RPM's. Meanwhile the Ecodiesel would be sitting at 2500 rpm getting better fuel economy while doing so comfortably. Torque is king when towing - horsepower is nice for racing but doesn't help you much when pulling a heavy load.

My day-to-day driving yields me 24 mpg's in a mix of city/highway/country roads. On the highway I regularly see 27 to 29 mpg's when not towing. On a recent camping trip from home in NE Ohio to Nashville and back - a mix of flat central Ohio to very hilly Kentucky and Tennessee - I averaged 13.2 mpg running between 65 and 68 mph. That's nearly twice the fuel mileage an Ecoboost would get on the same trip. And on the longer climbs up the Kentucky and Tennessee hills the transmission rarely downshifted leaving my RPM's at around 2200. Very comfortable.

Now, is the comfort and ease of towing with a diesel worth it vs a gasser? Is the added initial cost of a diesel worth it? That's a personal call but I can say from my own experience that I will never go back to towing with a gasser. The diesel just makes it effortless and the way the manufacturers are pricing the 1/2 ton diesels they are within just a few hundred dollars of the large V-8's offered in the trucks. Worth it to me.

Here's the mileage from a recent 760 mile trip from Ohio to Central PA and back (not towing) on ONE tank of fuel. Certainly not flat from Eastern Ohio along I-80 to Central PA. Didn't have to pay exorbitant fuel prices in Pennsylvania - I filled up when I got home.



I've said my peace. Back to the original thread....

Bob

I wish I could get an oil change on a diesel in Ontario Canada for that. My buddy that owns a marina does his oil changes on his eco diesel and it costs him about 150.00. My EcoBoost has a 16k for my first oil change according to the computer. With on 1200klm on my truck we headed to Florida I got 27.5 miles to the gallon doing the speed limit. I have no way to do the oil changes myself and here it would cost me 185.00 every 10,000klm the GD tune would extend the oil change range but for me the Ecodiesel while it is a really nice vehicle was just not a good fit for our needs. Thank you for your input.

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[10sne1]

On the edge of our seat! What did TT did ya get? We bought a 2150TB last month, great fit for us. Very comfortable tow! We too, went from trailer to gulf harbor home, big boats to small boats, sold harbor home. Now bass fish small boat and camp small trailer. Life is good.

[10sne1]

I see ya went with the 2250. Congrats!

[iproff1]

I see ya went with the 2250. Congrats!

We went into the dealer today and closed on a 2450RL. The floor plan is perfect for a couple and it has the theater seating and the dinette that will allow our two grandsons to sleep over if they want, there 3 and 6. We would have bought the 2250RK as it is the new lighter colours and I really like some of the changes, fridge handles that lock the outside panels the headboard in the bedroom and the LED reading lamps on the new colour scheme are huge improvements.

I was hoping for the lighter colour model with the thicker outside door panels and slam handles but we were given a September deliver date so we bought the one on the lot so we can use it now.
They gave us s great price and are installing an observation camera for us also.

This has been a long process and a lot of research on the TV and the trailer. We decided on the Grand Design after seeing a number of models in Florida and spending 3 hours on one that a dealer setup for us a 297RL. We were impressed that in 100 degree heat the one ac unit being on could cool the coach to 72 degrees. We spent a few hours with a couple that had a 297 in Orlando that had lived in it for 2 years, they loved it and could not say enough how impressed they were with GD fit and finish.
The size was dictated to us by the truck we wanted and bought in May. The F150 with the trailer tow fits our needs and tow requirements for this trailer. We won't tow often if we tow 10 times a year I will be surprised. The F150 with it's 36 gallon tank and the 2.7 gives us a 1300km range when not pulling a trailer a huge plus for us.

So now I just need to download all the manuals from each manufacturer site for all the components in the RV. My amazon account has already taken a 1500.00 hit for things we need.

Thank you to everyone that answered my questions over the past 6 month or so and for everyone that gave me advice on TV and the trailer they tow and why. This forum has really helped us a lot.

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[Schiefswret]

Good luck with your GD Imagine. We are going to tour the GD mfg facility on 8/19 and anticipate purchasing the 2500RL when we return to Tampa. I’ve bought a number of things “backwards” also, it seems to be quite common. Travel safe.

[Schiefswret]

I can’t imagine that the dealership will not give you a package with all the Manuals, brochures, pamphlets, booklets, etc, etc for each system, appliance, etc in your RV. This seems to be a pretty typical procedure. Ask if you have to. Good luck.

[iproff1]

I can’t imagine that the dealership will not give you a package with all the Manuals, brochures, pamphlets, booklets, etc, etc for each system, appliance, etc in your RV. This seems to be a pretty typical procedure. Ask if you have to. Good luck.

Oh there is a package with all the manuals but I will download each manual or scan the ones it get. I just traded a 1988 Sea Ray a 31year boat that looked brand new in the cabin. I scanned every manual into a searchable pdf. It's so much faster to search a pdf for info rather than hunting through manuals. I even posted the manuals on the Sea Ray users group site. All my printed ones were in the original leather case from Sea Ray about 8" × 14" really nice. This is a picture of the cabin on a 31 year old boat. Our trailer will look this good when we are done with it. Another advantage of having a pdf you can print a page note any changes to the original installed item and you have a nice hard copy and you can scan the page to have a permanent record. The gentleman that traded his 2013 30qb trailer said when he looked at my boat said, my trailer does not look this new.

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[Tom&Trish]

Maybe not so backwards, seems a lot of us where boaters and went to RV camping. We had boats for 36 years. Started with ski boats and then got the 10 foot idus. We sold our 2000, 37 foot, twin engine, Silverton motor yacht in 2017. In 2015 we saw an “A” frame camper at the marina, so we bought it. Then traded it for a 15 foot Fun Finder in 2016. In 2017 we bought a 2018 Imagine 2150RB. After selling the boat we bought a Ford F250 diesel truck in 2018. Loved it and made lots of trips the longest driving from Florida to New Mexico to see the balloon festival. After a 2 1/2 month trip this year and visiting the Grand Design factory, we decided to buy a 2020 Reflection 303RLS. It has been dream so far!

I can tell you this, we pulled the Imagine 2150 with a 19 year old Ford Expedition V8. Got 9 to 10 mpg. Pulled it just fine, but a good anti sway / load equalization hitch is an excellent investment. BUT even more important is setting it up right and learning how to adjust the anti sway.
Good luck, the Imagine is a fantastic tow behind!

[iproff1]

Well tomorrow's the big day, the last on my list to get, we pick up our new 2450RL. It better be ready I have a camp site booked for 3 days, it's only 15 minutes from our house in Wasags Beach lol. Amazon has been here almost every day with items for the RV. We did get over to the trailer we traded our boat for and traded in on the new one right away. I set the WD hitch up to make the 40 minute drive to the dealer and set the brake controller up, 7.0 gain seemed like a bite high but it worked perfect at that setting. The dealer will set up the WD hitch on the new trailer correctly, I hope but I will make sure it is.
I will set up the Ford trailer system once I get it home on Monday.


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