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  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by xrated View Post
    Two things. It is a well known fact that most 3/4T DIESEL truck's have a payload in the 2100 - 2200 lb range. My previous truck, a F250, diesel, 4x4 CrewCab XLT ( not even a Lariat or King Ranch, or Platinum), had a whopping 2148 lbs of payload. The fancier versions would have been even less. You might say I have a bit of experience in that regard.

    Second thing.....all it takes is a quick Google search for the trailer in question to find, in this case, the Grand Design page for THAT trailer, If you scroll down that page, the list the empty weight of the trailer as well as the GVWR for the trailer. Using a very common number of 20% of the empty weight of the trailer to calculate the pin weight that will be on the truck, it's easy to see that number will exceed the payload capacity of the truck if the truck is like 99% of the other 3/4T DIESEL trucks. So do I know his truck's payload capacity....Nope, he never posted it. But, I did tell him to check it to know for sure....and I did tell him that most trucks like that will have a very low payload number....and I did tell him that if his truck is like that, even the empty trailer pin weight would overload his truck.

    Actually knowing the numbers is on HIM, not me. All I can do, as others have done, is try to steer him in the right direction before he makes a very expensive MISTAKE....like I did several years ago with my F250 purchase.

    I have spent many hours educating myself about towing dynamics and feel perfectly comfortable giving solid advice about truck/trailer combinations and whether or not that particular combination will fit into the criteria to safely tow AND to stay within the manufacturer's weight capacities.....all of them....GVWR, FAWR, RAWR, GCVWR, Payload, Towing Capacity, and Tire Load Capacity ratings.
    Dude you are a bit over the top/ adversarial with your recommendations. I have done the homework also, so I appreciate where you are coming from, but you seem to start from a position of anger or just very challenging in nature. Not sure if you are aware how this comes across. Not trying to pick a fight it just really noticeable. Do / did you have alot of towing experience prior to towing an RV?

  2. #12
    Site Team xrated's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakelab View Post
    Dude you are a bit over the top/ adversarial with your recommendations. I have done the homework also, so I appreciate where you are coming from, but you seem to start from a position of anger or just very challenging in nature. Not sure if you are aware how this comes across. Not trying to pick a fight it just really noticeable. Do / did you have alot of towing experience prior to towing an RV?
    I went back and re-read all my posts in this thread, and I see nothing "over the top" or adversarial about any of my comments.....maybe you just took it the wrong way since no one else has commented on my postings. My main goal with taking the time to post in these type of thread is that there are many, many folks that simply do no know for sure how to figure out if a certain truck/trailer combination will work safely and within the manufacturer's guidelines for never going over the stated capacities. I have no intention of being adversarial with anyone, just trying to help a member that asked about his truck capabilities for a possible upgrade to a heavier trailer. That is what all of us can/should be doing when another member asks for help. If they heed the advice, that's fine, if they don't, well, as least we tried.

    As far as my towing experience, I've been towing since I turned 16 years old back in 1970 or so. Those were all mostly motorcycle type trailers, a few small utility trailers, jet skis, then a large boat later on. In 2016, I bought a 34 1/2' tow behind toy hauler and a few year before that I had bought a F250 Diesel, 4x4, CrewCab. At that time, I knew basically nothing about towing heavy and just figured that I had a 3/4T diesel truck.......I should be able to tow about anything I wanted to tow. Well, that didn't work out too well as the small payload of the F250, combined with 1400+ lbs of tongue weight, plus a little over 600 lbs of aux. tank and fuel in the bed, put me right at/slightly over the payload capacity of that truck. In 2017, I purchased a F350 Dually, 4x4, CrewCab as I wanted to have no worries about sitting on the edge payload wise. I spent many hours researching, asking a million questions on different forums, and generally educating myself about towing dynamics and how everything ties together to make a truck/trailer combo safe and within capacity limits. I also knew that the Dually was WAY overkill for my tow behind T.H., but I also knew that if I bought something like that, there would be plenty of truck for my next T.H......a large 5th Wheel. This past March I purchased the Momentum 394M that has a GVWR of 20,000 lb and before I bought it, I did all the calculations for worst case scenario of that truck and that trailer.....and I was good in every single category of weight capacities.

    The mistake I made years ago by getting the wrong truck and not knowing squat about towing/weights/etc, cost me a tidy sum of money...going from the F250 to the Dually. So in summary, I am here to both learn as much as I can, and to help others as much as I can. I do have a lot of knowledge about the towing dynamics, but I'm certainly not big-headed about it and realize that I still have many things to learn in the RV world.
    2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
    2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
    2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
    Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing

    "If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"

  3. #13
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    Very possible I just took it that way. Thanks for the explanation. Coming from the ranching community, I know no one who has ever looked at towing capacity, it just kinda pulls it or it doesn’t(not saying this is right, far from it). So I feel like I’ve come along way, knowing what the manufacturer stated limitations are and actually weighing soemthing I pull all the time. Thanks for your perspective.

  4. #14
    Site Team xrated's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jakelab View Post
    Very possible I just took it that way. Thanks for the explanation. Coming from the ranching community, I know no one who has ever looked at towing capacity, it just kinda pulls it or it doesn’t(not saying this is right, far from it). So I feel like I’ve come along way, knowing what the manufacturer stated limitations are and actually weighing soemthing I pull all the time. Thanks for your perspective.
    jake......I'm sorry if I came across that way, it certainly wasn't/isn't my intention. Over my 3 or 4 short years of being a part of several RV forums and communities, I have literally seen hundreds of folks that seriously don't have a clue about towing (I recognize them pretty easily as I was one of them several years ago). It hits way too close to home to see someone take some bad advice about this truck or that truck will tow your xxxx trailer....and you will be just fine. If they listen to the bad advice, it can be very costly, dangerous, and make for their new favorite pastime (camping), a horrible experience. One of the major reasons, in my opinion because I've seen it over and over and over again.....it that many of the newbies look at one number when they get ready to buy a truck for towing their trailer. That one number that they get hung up one (they genuinely do not know any better, I'm sure) is the TOWING CAPACITY of the truck. They either don't know or don't care about all the other capacities because that one number is the one that says.....yes, our Ford/GM/Ram/whatever brand, will tow XXXXX lbs of trailer. That's all they can focus on....that truck is big enough to to my trailer. They don't consider ALL the other numbers, that we've already mentioned.....just the towing capacity. When I try to explain about payload, GVWR, etc, etc. I normally get the same response...."But the brochure says that it will pull XXXXX lbs of trailer." Some are willing to listen and learn, some simply don't understand why it won't work for them, then the naysayers come along and the name calling starts........"Weight Police" is a popular one, self proclaimed expert is another, and they are probably some that can't or shouldn't be stated here! They want the truck or trailer so bad that many times they simple aren't willing to listen to an explanation or reason.....they found a number that works for them and by golly they are getting that truck...or that trailer for their existing truck.

    I know I've probably rambled on with this, but as I said, it hits home when I see someone get some bad advice and then they listen to it and kind of go blindly into a very big mistake. I know I can't "save the world" with what I do, but if I can help a few and keep them from making a bad mistake, then it is worth it. That is where I'm coming from!
    2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
    2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
    2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
    Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing

    "If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"

  5. #15
    Site Sponsor GeoffnCheri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob/OlallaWA View Post
    Lots of 2500 diesels pulling 5th wheels on the road. Many long threads on same question.
    Which does not mean the tow vehicle is overloaded, but most are

    A 337 will generally exceed the manufacturers GVWR, payload and potentially the RAWR of most 3/4 ton trucks.

    We loved the 337 but elected the 303 for this very reason.

    Enjoy your 337... no judgement regards
    Geoff and Cheri
    2011 F250 CC 6.7L
    Firestone Ride Rite Airbags
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    2018 Reflection 303RLS, Build date 9/2017
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  6. #16
    Setting Up Camp
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    What about airbags?

    Quote Originally Posted by GeoffnCheri View Post
    Which does not mean the tow vehicle is overloaded, but most are

    A 337 will generally exceed the manufacturers GVWR, payload and potentially the RAWR of most 3/4 ton trucks.

    We loved the 337 but elected the 303 for this very reason.

    Enjoy your 337... no judgement regards
    Hey guys, what are your thoughts about airbags on a 3/4 ton truck? It’s mainly the suspension that’s going to be overloaded, right?

  7. #17
    Fireside Member
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    Thanks for your help. Actual payload number on sticker is 2450#, but when I subtract actual CAT scale weight of 7200# from GVWR of 10000 #on sticker, I get 2800#. Rear axle weight load of 6200# on sticker with CAT scale measurement of only 3200# with full tank of fuel. When it is all added up, I got about 250# over on payload, but well under on all other measurements.

  8. #18
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    Good info, thanks. Do you put all of the added weight in the RV down as "pin weight"? I thought that most of that weight went towards the GCVWR, and only a % add to the pin. I am learning more each comment. And I thought that I knew it all when I woke up this morn. Maybe not.

  9. #19
    Setting Up Camp
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill G View Post
    Looking at a 2017 337RLS, moving up from 297RSTS. Would like to hear form those pulling 337 or like with a 3/4 ton. Seem to be slightly over on weight when figured one way and under when figured another. We know that most tow with 1 tons, but buying a new truck is not in the near term for us.
    Really depends on your specific truck. We Special Ordered our F250 with a 4:30 Axle and 6.2L Gas Eng designed with Fifthwheel MAX Towing in mind and have plenty of truck to handle the 337RLS with approx 13,200 Trailer Weight.

    With that said, I am looking to see what the 2020 F250 with the 7.3L Eng and 10 Speed Transmission has in-store...and if capacity far exceeds my 22,000lbs currently per design, then I may have to trade up.

    No a Diesel Fan at all...and I think the 7.3L is going to put out some good specs...we'll see.
    2021 F350 w/4.3 Axle and 7.3L Godzilla Eng w/ 10 Speed Transmission
    2019 GD Reflection 337RLS

  10. #20
    Left The Driveway
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    Quote Originally Posted by xrated View Post

    ...."But the brochure says that it will pull XXXXX lbs of trailer." Some are willing to listen and learn, some simply don't understand why it won't work for them, then the naysayers come along and the name calling starts........"Weight Police" is a popular one, self proclaimed expert is another, and they are probably some that can't or shouldn't be stated here! They want the truck or trailer so bad that many times they simple aren't willing to listen to an explanation or reason.....they found a number that works for them and by golly they are getting that truck...or that trailer for their existing truck.
    I know I've probably rambled on with this, but as I said, it hits home when I see someone get some bad advice and then they listen to it and kind of go blindly into a very big mistake. I know I can't "save the world" with what I do, but if I can help a few and keep them from making a bad mistake, then it is worth it. That is where I'm coming from!
    I AM one of those looking to avoid that TOWING Problem. Thanks for the input. And I am reading posts from everywhere about towing. And asking the sales people at the lots is a waste of time most times. All they want is to sell a RV. Soooooo, I'm here and at truck forums learning.

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