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Thread: My tow vehicle
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11-09-2019, 11:23 AM #81
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I get it. If I'm on the jury, I'll vote against gross negligence if you prove your truck is mechanically identical to another with a higher rating and that you have not exceeded that higher rating. It is a cruel irony that adding capability to a truck reduces the sticker capacity (e.g., F450 vs F350 DRW, upgraded F250 vs standard F250). I'll say it again, however, that the vast majority of F250's yanking around 5ers in my part of the country are over the GVWR of the equivalent F350.
2017 F-350 CCSB 6.7L
2021 Micro Minnie 2100BH
previously - Reflection 28BH, Intech Pursue
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11-09-2019, 11:34 AM #82
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2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing
"If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"
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11-09-2019, 11:45 AM #83
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2022 F450 Platinum
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2024 Brinkley Model Z 3610
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11-09-2019, 12:12 PM #84
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Simple answer? That might differ since not all trucks of an equal weight class are created equally. You might not need to do anything. Other than adding StableLoad upper overloads (to engage the overload springs sooner and keep the truck level), I have done nothing. Of course, my specific truck is as stout as you can possibly equip a F250. Maybe carry less. Certainly helper springs and replacement leaf springs are much cheaper than a new truck. Upgrading tires is relatively inexpensive. Heavy service break pads can benefit any truck. Once again, I put little stock in the assigned GVWR that drives the number on the payload sticker. If you are not exceeding the axle and tire ratings (derived from actual testing) and your truck has good road manners while towing, I don't think being over your GVWR/payload capacity poses an actual concern from a mechanical standpoint.
2022 F450 Platinum
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2024 Brinkley Model Z 3610
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11-09-2019, 12:13 PM #85
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Something that comes to mind here, and I am referring to the F250 and F350 (can't speak about GM or Ram products), for the model years 2011-2016....the F250 and the F350 definitely had some differences between the two of them in the rear end. Even though they both showed the same part number for the rear axle, the internal parts of the axle were different. I can't remember all of the differences, but the actual axle itself was smaller on the F250, the splines on the axle of course was different, bearings and something else as I recall. In fact, if you went to a Dealer and tried to order something that was internal to the axle assembly, they had to have the vehicle V.I.N. in order to get the correct parts....based on what truck you had. That may be different now, I really don't know as the 2017 model year and up is a different generation of the F250/F350 trucks. So besides the number of rear springs, there were some differences in the rear axle also. Brakes were the same on both though, so other than what I mentioned above, I know of nothing different between the two. So the capacity of the two trucks, based on what I know, was in fact different
2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing
"If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"
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11-09-2019, 12:24 PM #86
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StableLoad, helper springs, replacement leaf springs, Airbags.....none of that actually increase the designated payload capacity of any truck, but I'm 100% sure you already know that. I'm more in the camp of staying within the listed numbers, all of them. And as far as the tire ratings go, that would be the last of the progression to be overloaded. Payload/GVWR is first, axle ratings are second, then the tire load capacity is third if you continue to overload a truck past the listed ratings. In my opinion, there is a reason that every single truck manufacturer will clearly state in the owner's manual to never exceed any of the load capacities of a truck, which include Payload, GVWR, GCVWR, FAWR, RAWR, Tire Load Capacity, or the Towing capacity. We may simply have to agree to disagree on this one, but one thing is for sure, no one will ever be able to say that I am overloaded in anyway with my combo.
2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing
"If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"
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11-09-2019, 01:27 PM #87
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11-09-2019, 02:03 PM #88
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I agree backtrack.....the weight starts piling on pretty quickly for sure. I bought my Dually before I actually needed a Dually. I had a 13K tow behind T.H. that was 34 1/2' long, so pretty much overkill for that trailer. But I did the smart thing and went with a Dually as I knew that in the near future (1 1/2 years later)I was going to buy a much larger T.H. and it of course would be a 5ver instead of a tow behind. I bought the trailer that is in my signature.....and it has a 20K GVWR and I have almost 5300 lbs of payload capacity with that truck. I also carry an aux. fuel tank and loaded with fuel and counting the weight of the tank, that takes almost 600 lbs away from my truck's payload numbers....but I knew that too.
Last edited by xrated; 11-09-2019 at 02:06 PM.
2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing
"If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"
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11-09-2019, 04:18 PM #89
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xrated- You are the epitome of the sticker devotees! And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. You will always be operating within the capacity and capability of your truck. If you prioritize GVWR above all else, the other ratings are irrelevant to you. It is literally impossible to exceed your payload capacity and virtually impossible to exceed any other ratings. For my truck, I would exceed my GVWR by 1,880 lbs. before I exceeded my rear axle rating.
If you are going to prioritize ratings, I believe staying under the tire rating is far and away the most critical. I have never witnessed or heard of an axle or spring failing due to overload. Actually, I have never heard of them failing, period. They are obviously engineered to withstand forces well beyond their rating. Tires fail catastrophically all the time. They are susceptible to overloading, under inflation, over inflation and road hazards.
Most of us understand that no enhancement can increase your payload capacity as printed on the sticker in our drivers side door jamb but many of them do increase your actual capability.
Everything comes with a warning. It has little to do with protecting you and everything to do with the manufacturer protecting themselves from potential liability. Heck, a cup of coffee comes with a warning!
I do not intend this to be confrontational, but I have asked this question so many times and no member of the weight police has ever answered it; Do you adhere to all rules this fervently? When you see a rule, do you absolutely follow it without applying any logic or reason? Are you willing to exceed the speed limit on an empty highway in good road conditions? What is it about the payload issue that makes people so fanatical? Most of us make judgments every day before determining if we are willing to break a rule, exceed a limit, or surpass a rating. The weight police tend to be myopic on this one very specific rating and I highly doubt they are like that in other aspects of their life. I guess this is more of a character study than helpful towing information.
I respect the position of the weight police as it pertains to their personal choice but there is more than one way (no pun intended) to view this issue. Not many things in life are as black and white as the weight police tend to make this issue.2022 F450 Platinum
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2024 Brinkley Model Z 3610
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11-09-2019, 04:58 PM #90
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I only have one thing to note regarding your choice to disregard the posted ratings. By doing so you limit your ability to travel into Canada. I've forgotten if it was a member on this forum or another who lives in Canada and noted that in Canada their police now randomly pull over trucks, including RVs, and perform spot inspections with scales. If your trailer exceeds the GVWR you can't move the trailer until the problem is fixed. If your truck exceeds the limits, same thing, the problem must be fixed before you're allowed to move again. I don't remember if there are fines involved, but it wouldn't surprise me if there was. Again, your choice as you say. I certainly wouldn't want my vacation interrupted. It wouldn't surprise me if California implemented something like that given the number of RV's. California already has lower speed limits for any vehicle towing a trailer and shorter overall length allowed than other states.
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