New Trailer & Towing Question

[backtrack2015]

The 290BH has a pivoting pin-box which allows the use of a standard fifth-wheel hitch in a short-bed truck. That is a pretty nice feature in concept.

[MarkRizRV]

Here is a Thread about the pivoting Pin Box of the 150 Series

https://www.mygrandrv.com/forum/show...itch-Questions

Mark

[Troutd0g]

I recently traded a 22 ft TT for a 303 rls which is similar in size to the 29 RS and 29 bh and here are my observations. I towed a 21 ft boat for 25 years and am very used to backing and handling of “bumper pulled” trailers and boats. I was really nervous about towing a 5er - especially when we picked it up in Colorado Springs and had to tow it home 2.5 hours to Ft. Collins on the interstate. Everybody said I’d be fine and know what? I was. If you have experience towing you will adjust very quickly to the differences and you will really appreciate how stable and smooth it is while underway. Hitching and unhitching is also a breeze. Just remember:

- the 5th wheel short cuts across the turning radius of the truck a little bit during turns rather than following the path of the rear wheels like a bumper pull does. So make your turns wider.
- use your mirrors to keep an eye on the wheel path of the trailer
- with a short box truck ( which I have) you should get a slider hitch, but you will probably need to slide it back only very rarely. Still, having that ability will save your bacon (and rear window) in tight backing situations
- pay very close attention to how close the front of the 5th wheel is coming to the rear window if you have a short box. I have 2 friends who popped their windows out on their first season with their 5ers because they weren’t paying attention.
- make sure your tires are Load rated as E on your tow vehicle. Having a strong truck with adequate suspension isn’t the only consideration for the truck.

Bottom line is I think once you experience a fifth wheel you won’t want to go back to a TT. They are so awesome.

[Troutd0g]

One more point about the slider hitch. I was surprised at how strangely the handling is when backing while hitch is slid back. The pivot point is moved back a foot behind the rear axle and while it doesn’t seem like that would be very impactful, it is. I intentionally practiced tight backing with hitch slid back so that I wouldn’t be doing it for the first time when the need presented itself and I thought it handled strangely.

Have others had a similar experience with slid-back position?

[DaveMatthewsBand]

I’ve towed our Reflection fifth wheel 10,000 miles in the past 18 months (of full timing) and have never once needed to use the slider and I’ve gotten that thing into some tight spots!

I only got that version of the B&W because I had zero towing experience and was about to go full time. So a guy that was brand new to towing never even needed it!

With this in mind, if there comes a time when I cannot maneuver without using the slider, I would just opt for a different spot.

I have the 6’9” bed. If I had an 8’ bed I would definitely never need a slider!

If we had a half ton truck with the little 5.5 bed it might come in handy though.

As far as towing that rig with a gasser goes I’ve never done it so all I can give is my experience caravanning with someone who does...

We caravanned for 7 months with another Reflection (but his is 2k# heavier) and he tows with a Dodge 3/4 ton 6.4 Hemi. I have a diesel 3/4 ton.
Just for reference, my trailer is about 9k#, his is about 11k# and the 290BH is about 10k#.

We towed together through Arizona, California, Oregon, Washington, and Nevada. The whole time I had to wait for him to catch up, and not a little, it was constantly. And I slowed down!
Simply entering a highway and getting up to speed I was a couple miles ahead, then towing through the mountains, he was miles behind me.
On long steep grades he had to go much slower so his revs didn’t get too scary high.
And his wife never got comfortable listening to the truck revving to almost 6,000 rpm.
Whether it is meant to or not, there’s something unnerving about that unless you’ve spent your whole life doing it!
The exhaust brake is the number one best part of towing with a diesel, because we aren’t revving like that, the truck “sounds normal” and the ability to keep up with traffic going uphill all adds to your comfort level being far higher.

You already have the gasser so unless you’re planning on upgrading to a diesel, my point is you can tow that 290, but you’ll have to get used to going really slow and get comfortable with high revs.
Or get a lighter trailer.

Incidentally my fuel tank is 6 gallons smaller than his but I normally had a quarter tank left when he was about empty. So we stopped for fuel a lot more often caravanning with them.

Like I said, these are my experiences with both types of motors in 3/4 tons towing the same places at the same time.


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[SGT ROC]

The engine isn't the biggest issue when towing with a gasser, gears are. I'm not saying that a gasser can hold a candle to a diesel, but they can be better than the above with the right gears. Mine has 4:10 gears and tows pretty well, even in the mountains where we live (no, they are not like the Rockies, but they do get steep and long). I could have gone diesel, but I do not want all of the things that go with it. The expense of the fuel. Having to buy DEF. The cost of oil changes, and fuel filter changes. There are those who will say the cost is not that much more. I have a friend who is in the excavating business. He has a diesel pick up, and regrets ever buying it. His basic comment is that the Diesel is for the construction/hauling/business, not for the casual hauler - as in RVing (unless full timing - that MAY be an exception).

[DaveMatthewsBand]

The engine isn't the biggest issue when towing with a gasser, gears are. I'm not saying that a gasser can hold a candle to a diesel, but they can be better than the above with the right gears. Mine has 4:10 gears and tows pretty well, even in the mountains where we live (no, they are not like the Rockies, but they do get steep and long). I could have gone diesel, but I do not want all of the things that go with it. The expense of the fuel. Having to buy DEF. The cost of oil changes, and fuel filter changes. There are those who will say the cost is not that much more. I have a friend who is in the excavating business. He has a diesel pick up, and regrets ever buying it. His basic comment is that the Diesel is for the construction/hauling/business, not for the casual hauler - as in RVing (unless full timing - that MAY be an exception).

I agree to a point... about gearing, since semis are able to tow such massive loads not only because of the diesel’s torque but the fact that they have such an extensive range.
So which is more important?

I’m curious if you could safely and comfortably tow a much larger trailer if you had another half dozen available gears in your gasser, and/or possibly an even lower rear end?

Just thinking out loud here... Why doesn’t a manufacturer build a gas heavy duty pickup truck with a super duper transmission? One capable of easily towing a 2X,000 lb. trailer?
Maybe someone does and I’ve just never noticed. I’d drive it because I hate smelling my diesel exhaust and paying $130 for an oil change.

Personally I can’t wait till an all-electric pickup is available, but unfortunately there’s currently no other option that comes even close to being as capable at towing as a diesel.


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[Hamiltonian]

I’ve towed our Reflection fifth wheel 10,000 miles in the past 18 months (of full timing) and have never once needed to use the slider and I’ve gotten that thing into some tight spots!

I only got that version of the B&W because I had zero towing experience and was about to go full time. So a guy that was brand new to towing never even needed it!

With this in mind, if there comes a time when I cannot maneuver without using the slider, I would just opt for a different spot.

I have the 6’9” bed. If I had an 8’ bed I would definitely never need a slider!

If we had a half ton truck with the little 5.5 bed it might come in handy though.

As far as towing that rig with a gasser goes I’ve never done it so all I can give is my experience caravanning with someone who does...

We caravanned for 7 months with another Reflection (but his is 2k# heavier) and he tows with a Dodge 3/4 ton 6.4 Hemi. I have a diesel 3/4 ton.
Just for reference, my trailer is about 9k#, his is about 11k# and the 290BH is about 10k#.

We towed together through Arizona, California, Oregon, Washington, and Nevada. The whole time I had to wait for him to catch up, and not a little, it was constantly. And I slowed down!
Simply entering a highway and getting up to speed I was a couple miles ahead, then towing through the mountains, he was miles behind me.
On long steep grades he had to go much slower so his revs didn’t get too scary high.
And his wife never got comfortable listening to the truck revving to almost 6,000 rpm.
Whether it is meant to or not, there’s something unnerving about that unless you’ve spent your whole life doing it!
The exhaust brake is the number one best part of towing with a diesel, because we aren’t revving like that, the truck “sounds normal” and the ability to keep up with traffic going uphill all adds to your comfort level being far higher.

You already have the gasser so unless you’re planning on upgrading to a diesel, my point is you can tow that 290, but you’ll have to get used to going really slow and get comfortable with high revs.
Or get a lighter trailer.

Incidentally my fuel tank is 6 gallons smaller than his but I normally had a quarter tank left when he was about empty. So we stopped for fuel a lot more often caravanning with them.

Like I said, these are my experiences with both types of motors in 3/4 tons towing the same places at the same time.


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I think it also depends how you drive. I pass people driving trailers smaller or lighting than mine with diesel pickups all the time on the highways, or pass them on single lane roads because they're just not driving.

I also don't care about RPM, if she has to purr to get going then so be it.

And for that Dodge, I do believe that they come in a lower gear ratio that Ford unless you opt for higher. I think when I was looking they may have come with 3.55 unless you opt for the 4.10s.

[Hamiltonian]

That is why I opted for the gas. I only put maybe 6-8000 miles on my truck a year, so the additional $10,000 for a diesel would just never be justified or recouped. And then cheaper oil changes and no injectors to go one day etc etc. Maybe just wish I had of ordered the 4.30 gears and 5th wheel prep package.

So since I didn't order the prep package, how much is having the hitch installed into the bed of the truck going to butcher it? And if I was to ever remove those rails, can the holes be filled with bolts or plugs?

[DaveMatthewsBand]

That is why I opted for the gas. I only put maybe 6-8000 miles on my truck a year, so the additional $10,000 for a diesel would just never be justified or recouped. And then cheaper oil changes and no injectors to go one day etc etc. Maybe just wish I had of ordered the 4.30 gears and 5th wheel prep package.

So since I didn't order the prep package, how much is having the hitch installed into the bed of the truck going to butcher it? And if I was to ever remove those rails, can the holes be filled with bolts or plugs?

I’ll let you in on a secret... I bought my truck used so that $10,000 extra thing... is not really a thing.

When I was looking at used fully-loaded crew cab 4x4 3/4 tons the gassers were only about $2k less.
Twice the torque and an exhaust brake for $2k was a no-brainer for me.

As far as maintenance goes, people have this funny yet false sense that gas motors are somehow more reliable. This is my 6th pickup. The first 5 were gassers, from 4 different brands, and all were in the shop pretty regularly.
I’ve owned the diesel for 3 years next month and it’s never been in the shop.
(And I’ve towed over 10,000 miles with it in the past 18 months)
So much for higher maintenance costs.

I don’t doubt some folks have had their diesels cost them a lot of money but my experience has been the opposite.

Oh, and as far as damage to your bed goes...
If you ever do remove the rails, you’ll have 8 or 10 holes about a half inch in diameter in your bed. So you’re better off just leaving the rails there for the next owner. The rail kits are only about $150 new anyway so you’re not really giving away anything. Just keep your hitch.




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