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  1. #21
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    I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in here based on my real-world experience.

    I had a 2017 half ton RAM and a year later I bought a 2018 230rl. I made the mistake of not going by my door sticker and was only relying on RAM's website #s when I purchased my 230rl (that, and not only the GD dealer, but the GD factor rep told me my 1/2ton would have no problem with the 230rl). I knew my payload was going to be at or slightly over the published payload ratings, but I figured I was close enough.

    The day I drove the new 230rl away from the lot, when hooked up completely empty, the truck squatted quite a bit but the trailer was riding level. The hitch installer at the dealer told me "yea I figured you'd be squatting way more than that and that we wouldn't be able to let you leave, but I think you're ok". That comment worried me a bit, but hey, at least I was level. Now I had never pulled a 5th wheel, but had towed plenty of travel trailers, utility trailers, etc... Everyone had told me how much more I was going to like towing a 5th wheel. 5 minutes into the ride home I was 'white knuckling' it. If I drove 1mph over 50, I felt like the trailer was man handling the truck and yanking me side to side. "This is terrible!" I thought. The road was kinda rough due to construction, so I chalked it up to that.

    A few weeks later we were loading up the camper for our first trip. We weighed EVERYTHING that we put into the camper, as I knew my payload #s were pushing it, I wanted to know precisely how much I had loaded. Right at 1000lbs (total cargo capacity is around 2000). We drove to the grocery store to get some last minute items, and as I was coming back and looking at the rig, I realized that my squat was significant to say the least, enough to be really concerned. We were going to be driving right by the dealership on our way out of town, so I stopped by and had the hitch guy look at my setup. He said "well you're trailer is still level so I think you're fine, just don't drive really fast, maybe put some airbags on the truck when you get back."

    We spent a week and 1500 miles with the camper. The entire week I was 'white knuckling' it, I couldn't go over 50mph without feeling like I would get yanked off the road. It was a horrible towing experience, I truly feared for my safety and my wife's the entire trip.

    I weighed the rig at a cat scale, #s matched up with my own. I realized after getting back that relying on the RAM website #s was a newbie mistake. I was about 900lbs over payload, and over my rear axle rating. But only 900lbs? really? was that why I had such a horrible experience? The GD dealer/hitch guy said 900lbs was nothin', but man was towing this trailer AWFUL with this truck.

    So I upgraded. Ram 2500 Hemi, near 3000lbs of payload (the diesel would have put me closer to 2000lbs in a 3/4 ton and I would have STILL been overweight). How's my towing experience now? amazing. The 230rl is light enough that the hemi has no issues with it. I'm now well within my payload ratings and I tow more stable than I ever had, it's truly confidence inspiring.

    Take from this what you will, but my recommendation is to know your #s and stay within them. I think it's also worth noting that the 230rl has a pin weight a bit more than 20% (or at least mine does the way I have it loaded). I had a pin weight of well over 1700lbs (without a full tank of water)
    Last edited by shutterbug; 11-21-2019 at 09:15 AM.

  2. #22
    Seasoned Camper phonemannn's Avatar
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    You can never have too much truck when towing.. 1/2 ton to me should never be used to tow an RV. IMO. To me they are just cars with a bed.....
    2017 F350 Lariat, Dual rear wheels
    2017 GD 311BHS

  3. #23
    Rolling Along grampscamper's Avatar
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    I agree. Buying the correct truck makes towing a much more enjoyable experience. Not to mention safer.
    2023 Reflection 150 Series 260RD
    2022 Ford F350 SRW CC 4X4 Lariat 6.7 camper package, B&W Companion RVK3300

  4. #24
    Seasoned Camper phonemannn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grampscamper View Post
    I agree. Buying the correct truck makes towing a much more enjoyable experience. Not to mention safer.
    Yes. "white knuckle" towing is not fun. Or safe.
    2017 F350 Lariat, Dual rear wheels
    2017 GD 311BHS

  5. #25
    Seasoned Camper Big Blue's Avatar
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    shutterbug, my project for this week is reroute the vent line for the fresh water tank... so I can actually fill it more than 3/4's full.... And the fresh water tank on the 230RL sets above and behind the rear axle. with the vent line in the side of the tank 1 inch below the top I was 10 gallons short of full....
    2019 230RL Reflection ..... 1996 Dodge 2500 Cummins still pulling just as hard as the day I brought her home November 1995...3.6 Onan. 2 battleborns 300 watts solar, 1500 watt aims inverter....(Convictions are a far greater foe of truth than lies) {Nietztche}

  6. #26
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    Ram 2500 Diesel, 4x4 shortbed, 2015 yr & 230RL

    Quote Originally Posted by shutterbug View Post
    I thought I'd throw my 2 cents in here based on my real-world experience.

    I had a 2017 half ton RAM and a year later I bought a 2018 230rl. I made the mistake of not going by my door sticker and was only relying on RAM's website #s when I purchased my 230rl (that, and not only the GD dealer, but the GD factor rep told me my 1/2ton would have no problem with the 230rl). I knew my payload was going to be at or slightly over the published payload ratings, but I figured I was close enough.

    The day I drove the new 230rl away from the lot, when hooked up completely empty, the truck squatted quite a bit but the trailer was riding level. The hitch installer at the dealer told me "yea I figured you'd be squatting way more than that and that we wouldn't be able to let you leave, but I think you're ok". That comment worried me a bit, but hey, at least I was level. Now I had never pulled a 5th wheel, but had towed plenty of travel trailers, utility trailers, etc... Everyone had told me how much more I was going to like towing a 5th wheel. 5 minutes into the ride home I was 'white knuckling' it. If I drove 1mph over 50, I felt like the trailer was man handling the truck and yanking me side to side. "This is terrible!" I thought. The road was kinda rough due to construction, so I chalked it up to that.

    A few weeks later we were loading up the camper for our first trip. We weighed EVERYTHING that we put into the camper, as I knew my payload #s were pushing it, I wanted to know precisely how much I had loaded. Right at 1000lbs (total cargo capacity is around 2000). We drove to the grocery store to get some last minute items, and as I was coming back and looking at the rig, I realized that my squat was significant to say the least, enough to be really concerned. We were going to be driving right by the dealership on our way out of town, so I stopped by and had the hitch guy look at my setup. He said "well you're trailer is still level so I think you're fine, just don't drive really fast, maybe put some airbags on the truck when you get back."

    We spent a week and 1500 miles with the camper. The entire week I was 'white knuckling' it, I couldn't go over 50mph without feeling like I would get yanked off the road. It was a horrible towing experience, I truly feared for my safety and my wife's the entire trip.

    I weighed the rig at a cat scale, #s matched up with my own. I realized after getting back that relying on the RAM website #s was a newbie mistake. I was about 900lbs over payload, and over my rear axle rating. But only 900lbs? really? was that why I had such a horrible experience? The GD dealer/hitch guy said 900lbs was nothin', but man was towing this trailer AWFUL with this truck.

    So I upgraded. Ram 2500 Hemi, near 3000lbs of payload (the diesel would have put me closer to 2000lbs in a 3/4 ton and I would have STILL been overweight). How's my towing experience now? amazing. The 230rl is light enough that the hemi has no issues with it. I'm now well within my payload ratings and I tow more stable than I ever had, it's truly confidence inspiring.

    Take from this what you will, but my recommendation is to know your #s and stay within them. I think it's also worth noting that the 230rl has a pin weight a bit more than 20% (or at least mine does the way I have it loaded). I had a pin weight of well over 1700lbs (without a full tank of water)
    Thank you for your insight. I also have previously pulled a trailer with an undersized tow vehicle and it’s not a safe feeling whatsoever!

    Here is additional- real world, actual experience....
    I pull the 230RL With a Ram 2015, stock 2500 Diesel 4x4 , short bed , 4door cab using the Anderson Ultimate hitch. It pulls awesome and I also feel very confident. The vehicle is solid, absolutely no sway and can pull fast. I never even feel a tractor trailer coming up on my side! It actually drives better when I’m towing.
    No doubt, I’m likely much over the low payload that’s listed on the Ram of 2,022 lbs. That said, when I hitch-up the rear end drops in height only 1” lower then when my truck is empty. Those springs hardly move! I need a step stool to climb into the bed. However, flip side is with hitch setup and the stock height of my 2500, the GD 230rl unfortunately does not sit level but rather high in the front.
    I’m certainly NOT advocating to go over payload. But with my current set up, I can’t imagine “feeling” a much safer ride.
    Rob
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails F58AA980-A3BB-42F0-919E-84A50119DA06.jpeg   A8370D38-2B25-416F-BF2B-989A69C43B37.jpeg   4724FBC3-CA42-45DA-891E-9AD63003F61F.jpeg   D9CCF9FA-353C-48E8-8BF2-94D7E329E00C.jpeg  
    Rob
    230RL, Fifth Wheel, 2018 yr.
    Ram 2500 short bed, 4x4, Cummins Diesel, 2015 yr.
    Anderson Ultimate Hitch

  7. #27
    Seasoned Camper
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    If I'm wanting to see a video that is about towing capacities, I really don't care what upholstery liner is on the doors or what sound system is within....
    Jerry & Kelly Powell
    Zebulon, NC
    2020 Solitude 390RK-R :target:

  8. #28
    Seasoned Camper frank4711's Avatar
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    No surprise .... there are 1000's of 3/4 diesel trucks "over Payload" per door sticker .... it is a choice many make and argue ... the axle vs payload # based on assigned GWVR will never be settled ... it is odd that 2500 vs 3500 srw weight almost the same ... I picked a 3500 same price as 2500 bigger axles bigger payload ...
    Frank & Cindy --- S Class Solitude 2930RL-R ---2019 Ram 3500 Cummins 6.7 SRW 4x4 8' bed---Remi & Sage traveling Pomskies ---TST 507 TPMS ... B&W Patriot 18K---3.73 axle ... Predator 3500--Backflip MX4---48 days 2019---51 days camped 2020---***Payload 4394***

  9. #29
    Seasoned Camper Big Blue's Avatar
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    Dodge / Ram / FIAT... uses rear coil springs on 1500 & 2500 trucks and leaf springs on 3500 truck... For me this explains it all... My 1st pickup was a 1972 chevy C10 with rear coil springs nice ride, but couldn't haul much.... even half full it would duck walk at highway speeds... upgraded the suspension with some aftermarket springs and cured the problem.. It used to be that pickups were used for work.. that is no longer the case.. seems plenty for pickups never really get used... I guess people buy them for the image they project...Anyway thanks to all for info & opinions.... If my old '96 ever gives up, I'll be a much better educated truck buyer.....
    2019 230RL Reflection ..... 1996 Dodge 2500 Cummins still pulling just as hard as the day I brought her home November 1995...3.6 Onan. 2 battleborns 300 watts solar, 1500 watt aims inverter....(Convictions are a far greater foe of truth than lies) {Nietztche}

  10. #30
    Big Traveler Wicked ace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xrated View Post
    And as far as a F450 pulling a 5 car trailer, that may be very possible without overloading the truck, based on how much pin weight is put on it and how the trailer is loaded. With 5ver camping type trailers, you simply do not have a choice of where you put the stuff in the trailer like you do with a flatbed or equipment trailer or possibly the 5 car hauler trailer you are referring to. The camping trailer is going to put 20+ percent of the trailer weight on the truck as pin weight, apples and oranges.
    Lets take this a step further. The fellow that made the video used 20% of loaded vehicle weight with the proviso that the percentage was used as a safety net. It's better to overestimate than under. That is for a half ton towable 5W which by design are lighter in pin weight. I use 18% of GVW as a pretty accurate starting point. In actuality I'm right at 18% of loaded vehicle weight on the pin verified on a scale. Get into a Momentum or Solitude 5W and 25% pin weight is a better starting point.

    Regarding other reply's............ Sticking your fingers in your ears and going Lalalalalalala doesn't make the fact that you have exceeded the payload on your truck not a safety hazard. That big diesel motor weighs a S**t ton and your payload is used up carrying it around.
    Last edited by Wicked ace; 01-24-2020 at 01:54 PM.
    2018 F150 XLT 301a, Screw, 4x4, HDPP, Max tow, Andersen Ultimate w/ Curt Double Lock hitch.
    2019 Grand Design Reflection 150 series 260RD.... SOLD!!!!.

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