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  1. #1
    Rolling Along cookinwitdiesel's Avatar
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    GM seems to have discovered that disc brakes help with stopping distance....lol

    https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...ping-distance/

    It looks to me like they are essentially recommending disc brakes as a means to improve trailer stopping distance?
    2019 GMC Sierra 3500HD Denali Diesel DRW (Crew Cab | 8 Ft bed | OEM Puck System | Curt Gooseneck Ball for OEM Puck | Timbrens on rear axle)
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  2. #2
    Big Traveler
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    Yeah, seems that way, and also seems to have little/nothing to do with the truck, you can put better brakes on a trailer today and control them with any Ford/GM/etc standard controller. Seems like marketing to me, unless, of course, GM is going to get into the game of actually building trailer braking systems.. And, if so, let's hope they make them standard so we can use them with any trailer brake controller!

  3. #3
    Site Sponsor orbiker's Avatar
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    It says: To do this, GM equips both trailer and truck with its eBoost braking system and adds software to allow them to communicate.

    If the trailer had it's own brake controller and communicated with the truck controller; the process would be quicker because it would skip the electric to hydraulic controllers. The trailer could even have it's own anti skid system.
    KEN
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  4. #4
    Seasoned Camper Flip94ta's Avatar
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    Cost cost cost. They can make the worlds best trailer braking systems if they want, but are folks gonna want to pony up for more wheel sensors, abs modules and sensors? Plus the cost of the disc brake conversion.

  5. #5
    Big Traveler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flip94ta View Post
    Cost cost cost. They can make the worlds best trailer braking systems if they want, but are folks gonna want to pony up for more wheel sensors, abs modules and sensors? Plus the cost of the disc brake conversion.
    For sure, but it does seem that cost is cut in some very "questionable" areas in a lot of these rigs. Tires being real high on the list, you're gonna save 400 dollars (-100 per tire) to put on crappy tires that are so bad that there are endless threads about them giving way and tearing half the side of the rig off? And, while none of us want to talk about, I'm sure that someone has died as a result of the "China bombs" that come on lots of these things. That's some really difficult to justify math, save 400 dollars, cause 1000's in damage (when they let go), possibly kill someone.. Sure, why not?

    The other thing that I don't get is putting "barely adequate" axles on these rigs. My 351M has 2 7K axles and is rated to 16,800 lbs, IIRC. That's really questionable. Yes, I know how they get there (subtracting pin weight), but, still, what's the price jump for 8K axles? A few 100 dollars. And, like tires, if an axle/bearing lets go, that's gonna be a bad day. So why not "overbuild" them a little bit?

    The final one, and this I have yet to complete to comment on, but suspension on these trailers. I just bought a Roadmaster kit for my rig, IIRC, it was about 500 dollars to get shocks to dampen the motion of the trailer. That's so cheap you look at it and think, "why didn't they just do this from the factory"? Less of a safety issue than tires, but, certainly would stop some damage/warranty claims on broken running gear, and also make the vehicle last longer. It's one of those "so cheap, why not" things.

    Even if you add all this stuff up, on a 50-100K purchase, you're not looking at that much money.

    4 good tires vs 4 china bombs - +400
    Disc brakes instead of drums - +1500
    8K axles instead of 7K - +500
    Suspension/shocks - +500

    So, what are we talking here, ~3000 bucks or so? Let's put it in a range, 2500-5000 bucks, and say that's somewhere between 2-5% of the MSRP on these rigs. Maybe up to 10% on the less expensive models (but on them, I'd argue that the costs would be lower too, no reason to put 8K axles on a 10K trailer, for example). It's just not that much money to really increase safety, longevity, comfort, etc...

    I can only guess that the "market" just doesn't care. People don't buy these things because they are safe, have good axles/tires and are easy to tow, they buy them because they have 8 TV's and a 10K paint job.. Because those options are available from basically every manufacturer, where disk brakes and suspension systems are available from very, very few of them.

  6. #6
    Site Team traveldawg's Avatar
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    I think it's good someone has at least started thinking about brakes on a trailer.

    I think now that GM has kind of 'opened the door' maybe other manufacturers will join in. If for no other reason than to stay competitive (kind of like the great horsepower/torque escalating game they play).

    I'm not sure how it all works (vacuum, electric, combination) but it will nice to watch this segment bloom; assuming it get some 'traction'. yuk-yuk... Given that so few RV trailer manufacturers offer disc brakes now we can only hope that a newer technology will get adopted sooner rather than later.
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  7. #7
    Site Team WhittleBurner's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overtaxed View Post
    For sure, but it does seem that cost is cut in some very "questionable" areas in a lot of these rigs. Tires being real high on the list, you're gonna save 400 dollars (-100 per tire) to put on crappy tires that are so bad that there are endless threads about them giving way and tearing half the side of the rig off? And, while none of us want to talk about, I'm sure that someone has died as a result of the "China bombs" that come on lots of these things. That's some really difficult to justify math, save 400 dollars, cause 1000's in damage (when they let go), possibly kill someone.. Sure, why not?

    The other thing that I don't get is putting "barely adequate" axles on these rigs. My 351M has 2 7K axles and is rated to 16,800 lbs, IIRC. That's really questionable. Yes, I know how they get there (subtracting pin weight), but, still, what's the price jump for 8K axles? A few 100 dollars. And, like tires, if an axle/bearing lets go, that's gonna be a bad day. So why not "overbuild" them a little bit?

    The final one, and this I have yet to complete to comment on, but suspension on these trailers. I just bought a Roadmaster kit for my rig, IIRC, it was about 500 dollars to get shocks to dampen the motion of the trailer. That's so cheap you look at it and think, "why didn't they just do this from the factory"? Less of a safety issue than tires, but, certainly would stop some damage/warranty claims on broken running gear, and also make the vehicle last longer. It's one of those "so cheap, why not" things.

    Even if you add all this stuff up, on a 50-100K purchase, you're not looking at that much money.

    4 good tires vs 4 china bombs - +400
    Disc brakes instead of drums - +1500
    8K axles instead of 7K - +500
    Suspension/shocks - +500

    So, what are we talking here, ~3000 bucks or so? Let's put it in a range, 2500-5000 bucks, and say that's somewhere between 2-5% of the MSRP on these rigs. Maybe up to 10% on the less expensive models (but on them, I'd argue that the costs would be lower too, no reason to put 8K axles on a 10K trailer, for example). It's just not that much money to really increase safety, longevity, comfort, etc...

    I can only guess that the "market" just doesn't care. People don't buy these things because they are safe, have good axles/tires and are easy to tow, they buy them because they have 8 TV's and a 10K paint job.. Because those options are available from basically every manufacturer, where disk brakes and suspension systems are available from very, very few of them.
    A big problem with doing all that is the additional cost of all that. I realize that when financing it would not effect your payment too bad. The problem is that most people are price conscious. That is why Walmart does so well. Most people that buy trailers are weekend warriors. This is a luxury for most peole but they don't want it to take away from their everyday lives. Thus the less they pay the better. That is the thinking that manufactures have to deal with. So if you drive your price up most people will go next door and buy the cheaper one.
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  8. #8
    Seasoned Camper Flip94ta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhittleBurner View Post
    A big problem with doing all that is the additional cost of all that. I realize that when financing it would not effect your payment too bad. The problem is that most people are price conscious. That is why Walmart does so well. Most people that buy trailers are weekend warriors. This is a luxury for most peole but they don't want it to take away from their everyday lives. Thus the less they pay the better. That is the thinking that manufactures have to deal with. So if you drive your price up most people will go next door and buy the cheaper one.
    I agree. Look at Semi’s still using drum brakes!! Way more semi’s on the road than campers, with more safety complications. Over 75% of new ones still come with all drum brakes.

    I agree on the tires as well. Car manufacturers are guilty as well, there are sometimes a spec tire from a reputable manufacturer like Goodyear or Michelin that’s been water downed and installed on OEM truck and you’ll see the most mixed reviews since the general public doesn’t realize there’s 2-4 different versions of the same exact tire out there. Michelin AT2 and Goodyear SRA’s come to mind. It’s possible to to buy completely different versions of those tires and have very different outcomes.

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