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Thread: Wow speechless on electrical in Solitude 379 FL

  1. #1
    Seasoned Camper Abqscott's Avatar
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    Wow speechless on electrical in Solitude 379 FL

    Took some pictures of wiring and plumbing on my 2015 379 FL. I am speechless. I have been a master plumber, gas fitter, and heating and cooling contractor for 30 years. I would be absolutely embarrassed at the quality of this workmanship. A first month apprentice should be able to do better work than this. Who thinks it is a good idea to hack through pressed board and run wiring that will ultimately rub through causing short circuits and leaks in the electrical & plumbing. I can rerun and protect most of the wire and plumbing behind the bulk head in a few hours. It would take a lot to correct what I believe is beyond that. The difference in this finished product and what it could have been is a few proper sized hole saws and a lot of strapping which apparently is not used much. A residential home does not move at highway speeds nor is it subject to the bumps and vibrations, yet a residential home systems must be inspected by an inspector that knows proper mechanical and electrical practices including proper strapping, pipe and electrical protection along with proper clearances. Most of the problems that occur on the 5th wheel forums fail because of the installation practices during assembly while everything is accessible, it would have added a couple of hours to the manufacture process to do this right. Wouldn't it be great if a manufacturer set the industry standard by doing the hidden work right. Think of the warranty costs this would save not to mention the reputation they would have that would change this industry forever. Think of your customers that won't get stranded on a trip. We hate taking our coaches to the dealer for warranty service and there are very few dealers making a living off of service they make it in sales. 0nce again Grand Design has great finish, but electrical and plumbing are embarrassing. Plumb, square, neat and clean. If it looks right it will probably work right for a long time. Tired of the pump running every time you use water? Why not add a simple residential expansion tank to this system. Not only will you be able to use the bathroom in the middle of the night without the pump coming on, but the water hammer and pump noise will be greatly reduced. Just a thought.
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  2. #2
    Fireside Member apulido's Avatar
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    I have to agree. You should post this the tech side of the forum and see what kind of response you get then.
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    AL and Holly
    355TH Momentum, #00811, 2014
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  3. #3
    Site Sponsor Cate&Rob's Avatar
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    Hi Abqscott,

    I am new to RVs but was equally astonished at what I found "behind the walls".
    See http://www.mygrandrv.com/for...ghlight=Wiring
    I have been involved with boats for years and these "moving residences" have very strict electrical and plumbing codes.
    Per the referenced thread, I was assured that this is "normal" for the RV industry.
    But, that doesn't make it right.

    Rob
    Cate & Rob
    (with Border Collies Molly & Angel and their kitty Gracie)
    2015 Reflection 303RLS #792
    2014 F150 EcoBoost 4x4 Crewcab with Max Tow and Heavy Payload pkgs
    Whitby, Ontario, Canada

  4. #4
    Long Hauler Poppy's 5th Wheel's Avatar
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    It doesn't make it right but this is what it looks like on every unit we have had! I am about to get behind our pass through panel myself and hold my breath for what I may find That one shot with the electric wiring resting next to the bare, sharp screws is a bit scary!

    It will disappoint me but it will not take away from my love affair with this trailer
    Paul "Poppy" and Deb Cervone
    2015 Grand Design Reflection 337RLS
    SteadyFast Stabilizers; MORryde PIN box; Onan LP Generator with 50amp Automatic Transfer; Dual 6v Trojan T-105 Batteries; Victron BMV700 Battery Monitor System; Renogy Solar 400 watts (tilting roof mounts); Renogy 40 amp Rover MPPT controller; Remote Controlled 1000w Pure Sine Wave Inverter; Sailun S637 ST235/85/R16 tires; Sony, Samsung Entertainment System; Residential Kitchen Faucet and Soap Dispenser; Smart Tile; Lifted and balanced with Trailer Axle Blocks; upgraded to 3500# spring packs; Titan electric / hydraulic Disc Brakes; LED rear tail/stop/turn lights; Exterior Beer Bottle Opener; Lots More .....
    2016 GMC Denali 3500HD SRW Duramax/Allison CC 4x4; Andersen Ultimate 5th Wheel Hitch; Tire Minder TPMS; Husky in bed Low Profile Tool Box; Timbren SES
    2007 Corvette Atomic Orange Z51; with Too Much to List SOLD
    2009 Cadillac CTS; Bone Stock
    1955 Buick Century; 64 Buick Wildcat Nailhead 401 cu in / 325 hp; ST400


  5. #5
    Seasoned Camper Abqscott's Avatar
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    I agree poppy. They don't have to all be that way. You can't believe how easy this was to do right. I am not going to keep complaining and when I get some time I will make the needed repairs and share some more photos. I love the rig, but it would have been so easy to make this a 10.

  6. #6
    Seasoned Camper GD350M's Avatar
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    But you paid extra to have it inspected and approved to the "RVIA Seal" of approval. That little sticker that is on your door going into the coach cost you about $150 more on your total cost of purchase. It is set in place to make sure this doesn't look like that. I had the same issue when I opened up my basement wall and saw that. You can go check out my post and see the pictures I took as well.
    Stephen & Nikki

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    2015 Grand Design Momentum 350M
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    Commercial Member
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    Problem is, in the RV industry if you do take the time to do everything "residentially perfect", you couldn't afford to by it.

    Time is everything in building them, and GD is already 6 units a day less than the average RV manufacturer. Take even longer, and they may as well be custom builders, building $200,000 coaches.

    I've seen what the guts of a $100,000 (actual dealer cost) 5th wheel looks like. and they don't look any different.
    Inventory Manager at Tom Schaeffer's RV, Shoemakersville, PA www.tomschaeffers.com
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    2011 RAM 3500 SRW Outdoorsman Edition 4X4, 6.7 Cummins--TWEAKED!


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    Site Sponsor Cate&Rob's Avatar
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    @huntr70

    If you use your truck rather than your house as the comparison to the RV industry, things might appear different.
    Automotive and truck manufacturers have used chafe protected wiring harnesses, hose harnesses and secured ductwork for decades.
    As well as improving durability and aiding repair processes, this speeds up assembly line production and quality.
    I don't think that it would double the cost of a coach to tie wrap and secure the rats nests of wires and hoses in an orderly fashion.

    Rob
    Cate & Rob
    (with Border Collies Molly & Angel and their kitty Gracie)
    2015 Reflection 303RLS #792
    2014 F150 EcoBoost 4x4 Crewcab with Max Tow and Heavy Payload pkgs
    Whitby, Ontario, Canada

  9. #9
    Commercial Member
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    Most automotive (and motorhome applications) use pre-fabbed wire harnesses. Definitely helps in assembly when you throw in a harness versus doing everything separately.

    A house is much more like your RV than a car or truck is...
    Inventory Manager at Tom Schaeffer's RV, Shoemakersville, PA www.tomschaeffers.com
    [email protected]
    2011 RAM 3500 SRW Outdoorsman Edition 4X4, 6.7 Cummins--TWEAKED!


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    Site Sponsor Canyonlight's Avatar
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    The basement pictures of the wiring and plumbing rats nest are a concern. I believe GDRV has a potential significant competitive advantage opportunity here.

    Like Rob & Cate who still are boaters, we were boaters (we the performance market) for more than 30 years. Because boats can take severe punishment boat testing magazines clearly hit (then and now) the manufacturers where overall products had challenges and opportunities. Wiring and other lines not supported and not routed in an organized manner were tops on the list. RV’s getting bounced down the highway thousands of miles share a similar concern.

    Several boating manufacturers raised the bar and made a commitment to produce even more superior products. They had higher standards and fresh thinking. While these boats (some models) did cost more money in some cases, it was not exorbitantly more and knowledgeable experienced boaters supported (and still do) these companies. Formula, Regal, Cobalt immediately come to mind. They believed that the investment for longer term gain was not only good business and justified any short term sacrifice but was the right thing to do.

    The obvious benefit to reduced re-work and time spent identifying and correctly problems was an important result but more importantly customers experienced significantly less problems and had a superior boating experience. What happened next……..less warranty claims, less ticked off customers, less customer bashing of the product, customer/others product and company praise, product sales gains, stronger balance sheets, happier corporate and employees and on and on.

    Any business, company, industry, or individual can make the same commitment. It starts with the attitude and fresh thinking that it can be done and we will do it. Detractors are selling themselves and the industry short. Look what GDRV has already done in the RV war……..they can win this battle too.

    Dan
    Dan & Carol
    2014 303RLS Reflection #185 (10/2013 build)
    2012 Silverado LTZ Crew Duramax 2500HD
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