User Tag List

Thanks Thanks:  0
Likes Likes:  0
Results 1 to 7 of 7
  1. #1
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    British Columbia, Canada
    Posts
    15
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Short in microwave wiring, fried junction box

    Background
    On a trip last winter my microwave breaker flipped off. I pulled out the microwave and checked the unit itself by plugging it into another outlet, it worked fine. The microwave in my unit it located in a slide out. During the summer I had someone check the wiring with an electrical meter. The wiring was fine from microwave to an interior junction box (behind the sofa) in the rear of the slide out. There was a short in the wire from slide out junction box to main panel. Unfortunately the wiring from the slide out goes inside the frame rails and above the insulating material on the bottom side of the frame. There are no wiring diagrams for RVs so it makes it difficult to find the problem.

    Investigation
    I undid some of the screws holding the black insulation to the underside of the frame rails to see where the wiring went and here is what I found. Just inside the frame rails there is a plastic junction box where the rubber coated exterior wiring is joined to the regular wiring running to the main electrical panel. This junction box was completely fried (see photos below) and was shorted out. The reason it fried is that the junction box is not water tight and it lays on top of the insulation material. There was some water on top of the insulating material and of course it got inside the box causing the short. I live on the wet (west) coast where it rains a lot. The insulating material on the underside of the frame rails is sealed at penetrations but it is not completely caulked around the perimeter. In very wet conditions since tires are immediately adjacent to the edge of the insulation it can enter between the frame rails. Also I did have a previous leak at the hose connection in the under floor storage space and it ended up between the frame rails. Since all the tanks are between the frame rails if any leaks occur it can get to these junction boxes.

    There was another junction box to the fridge which was on the verge of shorting out. I checked the slide out on the opposite side and found a similar junction box in it which just feeds a couple of wall outlets. It was not fried but when I pulled this one out to look at it I could feel a small zap as I had left the 110v power on when I checked this one. Lesson learned; always shut off the power.[ATTACH=CONFIG]30798Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_2948.jpg 
Views:	22 
Size:	72.7 KB 
ID:	30799

    Solution
    I cut out the deficient junction boxes and replaced them with residential building junction boxes with a gasketed cover and water tight connectors where the wires enter the box.

    Recommendations
    In my opinion the manufacturer has created a hazard by using junction boxes that are not water tight in this location and they should change this in the future. They could easily have mounted the box on the frame rail so it was above any water that entered.

    Every RVer should check this in their unit to make sure it is safe. I've lost an RV in the past due to a fire.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails IMG_2946.jpg  

  2. #2
    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    1,422
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by imrvman View Post
    Background
    On a trip last winter my microwave breaker flipped off. I pulled out the microwave and checked the unit itself by plugging it into another outlet, it worked fine. The microwave in my unit it located in a slide out. During the summer I had someone check the wiring with an electrical meter. The wiring was fine from microwave to an interior junction box (behind the sofa) in the rear of the slide out. There was a short in the wire from slide out junction box to main panel. Unfortunately the wiring from the slide out goes inside the frame rails and above the insulating material on the bottom side of the frame. There are no wiring diagrams for RVs so it makes it difficult to find the problem.

    Investigation
    I undid some of the screws holding the black insulation to the underside of the frame rails to see where the wiring went and here is what I found. Just inside the frame rails there is a plastic junction box where the rubber coated exterior wiring is joined to the regular wiring running to the main electrical panel. This junction box was completely fried (see photos below) and was shorted out. The reason it fried is that the junction box is not water tight and it lays on top of the insulation material. There was some water on top of the insulating material and of course it got inside the box causing the short. I live on the wet (west) coast where it rains a lot. The insulating material on the underside of the frame rails is sealed at penetrations but it is not completely caulked around the perimeter. In very wet conditions since tires are immediately adjacent to the edge of the insulation it can enter between the frame rails. Also I did have a previous leak at the hose connection in the under floor storage space and it ended up between the frame rails. Since all the tanks are between the frame rails if any leaks occur it can get to these junction boxes.

    There was another junction box to the fridge which was on the verge of shorting out. I checked the slide out on the opposite side and found a similar junction box in it which just feeds a couple of wall outlets. It was not fried but when I pulled this one out to look at it I could feel a small zap as I had left the 110v power on when I checked this one. Lesson learned; always shut off the power.[ATTACH=CONFIG]30798Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_2948.jpg 
Views:	22 
Size:	72.7 KB 
ID:	30799

    Solution
    I cut out the deficient junction boxes and replaced them with residential building junction boxes with a gasketed cover and water tight connectors where the wires enter the box.

    Recommendations
    In my opinion the manufacturer has created a hazard by using junction boxes that are not water tight in this location and they should change this in the future. They could easily have mounted the box on the frame rail so it was above any water that entered.

    Every RVer should check this in their unit to make sure it is safe. I've lost an RV in the past due to a fire.
    Not sure which brand of GD trailer you have but there is a recall out for a large number of Reflection trailers for this exact issue. Since you mention that it sits on the insulation I suspect that you have a Solitude or Momentum. Seems that this is a problem on a number of the GD lines of trailers. I would flag this to GD as they may need to do a recall on Solitudes or Momentums as well to get this taken care of.

    Glad you found it before you had another fire.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

  3. #3
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    British Columbia, Canada
    Posts
    15
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Calbar View Post
    Not sure which brand of GD trailer you have but there is a recall out for a large number of Reflection trailers for this exact issue. Since you mention that it sits on the insulation I suspect that you have a Solitude or Momentum. Seems that this is a problem on a number of the GD lines of trailers. I would flag this to GD as they may need to do a recall on Solitudes or Momentums as well to get this taken care of.

    Glad you found it before you had another fire.

    Rob
    Thanks for the response and good info. It's a Reflection 293RE fifth wheel. I didn't buy the unit new but it would be nice if the manufacturers issued recalls like auto manufacturers so even if you were not the original owner you would get recall notices. I bought it from a dealer last year so it would also be nice if dealers took care of all recalls before they resell RVs. I will definitely contact GD about this and the dealer too.

  4. #4
    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    1,422
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by imrvman View Post
    Thanks for the response and good info. It's a Reflection 293RE fifth wheel. I didn't buy the unit new but it would be nice if the manufacturers issued recalls like auto manufacturers so even if you were not the original owner you would get recall notices. I bought it from a dealer last year so it would also be nice if dealers took care of all recalls before they resell RVs. I will definitely contact GD about this and the dealer too.
    I receive recall notices from Grand Design but I am an original owner. I would think that you would too if the dealer would have registered you with GD as the new owner. Just as an FYI there is also a customer satisfaction to add a heat shield to behind the microwave to prevent some heat discolouration of the wall behind it. If you go the GD website under owner support there is a section there called "Recall" where you can also check for any recalls on your unit.

    Good luck getting this fixed so that you don't have any issues.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

  5. #5
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    British Columbia, Canada
    Posts
    15
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Calbar View Post
    I receive recall notices from Grand Design but I am an original owner. I would think that you would too if the dealer would have registered you with GD as the new owner. Just as an FYI there is also a customer satisfaction to add a heat shield to behind the microwave to prevent some heat discolouration of the wall behind it. If you go the GD website under owner support there is a section there called "Recall" where you can also check for any recalls on your unit.

    Good luck getting this fixed so that you don't have any issues.

    Rob
    I've checked the recall and found it applies to 2016 to 2019 units. Since mine is a 2015 it's not covered but I've emailed GD to say they should be recalling 2015's also. They've said they are looking into it and will get back to me.

    When I pulled out my microwave I did notice there is no wall protection so fix that now. The outlet serving the microwave is one of those without any fire proof enclosure so I replaced that with a metal box.

    thanks for the info, this forum is definitely useful.

    Ian
    Ian
    2015 Reflection 29RES
    2013 RAM 3500 HD long box SRW
    British Columbia, Canada

  6. #6
    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    1,422
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by imrvman View Post
    I've checked the recall and found it applies to 2016 to 2019 units. Since mine is a 2015 it's not covered but I've emailed GD to say they should be recalling 2015's also. They've said they are looking into it and will get back to me.

    When I pulled out my microwave I did notice there is no wall protection so fix that now. The outlet serving the microwave is one of those without any fire proof enclosure so I replaced that with a metal box.

    thanks for the info, this forum is definitely useful.

    Ian
    Glad my information was helpful. GD must have changed the microwave outlet at mine is in a box. I know which the type you are talking about though. I have them in other areas of the trailer. Hope GD makes it right and recalls your year of trailer too.

    I get a lot of information and help on this forum as well.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

  7. #7
    Big Traveler Wicked ace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Southeast PA.
    Posts
    1,411
    Mentioned
    20 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by imrvman View Post
    I've checked the recall and found it applies to 2016 to 2019 units. Since mine is a 2015 it's not covered but I've emailed GD to say they should be recalling 2015's also. They've said they are looking into it and will get back to me.

    When I pulled out my microwave I did notice there is no wall protection so fix that now. The outlet serving the microwave is one of those without any fire proof enclosure so I replaced that with a metal box.

    thanks for the info, this forum is definitely useful.

    Ian
    If you check I believe you would find the recall is for convection microwaves that require a heat shield. A search here would have given a few previous threads covering it.
    https://www.mygrandrv.com/forum/show...416#post291416
    2018 F150 XLT 301a, Screw, 4x4, HDPP, Max tow, Andersen Ultimate w/ Curt Double Lock hitch.
    2019 Grand Design Reflection 150 series 260RD.... SOLD!!!!.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

DISCLAIMER:This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Grand Design RV, LLC or any of its affiliates. This is an independent site.