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  1. #1
    Site Sponsor ajg617's Avatar
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    Factory Solar and Generator - overkill?

    I've been reading the pros and cons of both and/or neither. Retiring in a couple of months and see some long trips over the next couple of years. Want the residential refrig. Not hard to envision staying off grid for a couple of nights in transit due to the length of the trips (and I'm not in any hurry). Spent many a night in rest areas and Walmarts years past, both in RVs and back seat of my truck.

    So, month long trips, stay at a couple of interesting unplanned locations on the way to/from and not necessarily all the time at an rv park - probably most of it though at destination. While visiting, will be staying with our kids, so park the rv off site somewhere? - their driveways won't work for sure. I'm treating this like a second home, but mobile.

    Caveat, portable generators are too heavy for me to lug and connect (I have one at home and it is heavy, even on wheels and especially in snow) - at my age, convenience is key. It's been 20 years since our last RV but I was younger and had 5 kids to help. I'm also intolerant of heat and cold at times (always have been and it varies). For some reason, 70 degrees in summer is too warm, and 70 degrees in winter is too cool. I also need my coffee to go in the morning - my better half even more so!

    That said I'm considering ordering both from the factory. I haven't read any posts where I noticed folks have ordered both. So, looking for opinions and inevitable follow-up of to LiFePO4 or not and what would be involved over and above what the factory delivers if I order both. I'm practicing buying the last RV first here - which in all probability will be true unless a lemon is delivered.
    Thanks in advance,
    AJG

  2. #2
    Long Hauler geotex1's Avatar
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    Factory solar barely keeps the battery topped off. Most every boondocker builds/has installed custom solar setups capable of powering the entire rig for days. To do so, even DIY, is a big dollar investment and does not sound like what you will need for the minimal off-grid stops you're indicating. I would say go with the factory Onan generator and then upgrade your battery storage (type and number) when you get the unit. You'll also need to replace the factory battery charger if upgrading to lithium.

    Much more detail can be found spending some time searching, and there are serious solar folks here.
    Rob & Nikki + Cloverfield
    2020 Grand Design Solitude S-Class 3350RL
    2015 RAM 3500 Longhorn Laramie Crew Cab, Long Bed, 4x4 Dually Cummins/AISIN

    Mountains of Pennsylvania

  3. #3
    Site Sponsor ajg617's Avatar
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    Thank you @geotex1. I can wire my house, but understanding solar is well above my current knowledge. My thought was solar to keep the refrig and a few other items operational, and generator for AC if needed.

  4. #4
    Long Hauler bertschb's Avatar
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    The nice thing about the factory 300W solar package is it does a great job keeping the batteries charged while towing with a residential fridge. Yes, I could just keep the fridge door closed on shorter travel days and the fridge would probably hold the temp pretty well but we will sometimes stop and eat lunch and grab things from the fridge. Plus I've done 17 hour days more than once. With the factory solar system, we do whatever we want and never worry about the batteries or fridge usage. The solar system also does a great job keeping the batteries topped off while in storage. The solar package comes with a 2,000W inverter so you can run a few things other than the fridge. Of course, you could just get more batteries rather than the solar system. That would help for travel days but not for storage charging.

    However, if you're planning on spending a couple days off the gird on a fairly regular basis and don't want to use a portable generator, I would recommend the factory generator. Either that or a serious battery bank and solar system. The nice thing about the factory generator is you can just flip a switch and you have power. Cloud cover doesn't matter. Number of days off the grid doesn't matter. Battery status doesn't matter. Just flip a switch. Doesn't get much easier than that!

    If I knew my next RV would be my last (I'm on my third RV in four years so that's not likely), I would order my rig with both the solar and generator packages.
    Brian & Kellie
    2020 Solitude 310GK-R, FBP, 1,460w solar, 540ah BBGC3, MORryde IS w/disc brakes
    2020 F-350 Platinum SRW Powerstroke Tremor, 60g TF fuel tank, Hensley BD3-F air bag hitch

    Previous setups:
    2019 Solitude 373FB-R, 2019 F-350 Platinum DRW Powerstroke, Hensley BD5 air bag hitch
    2016 Reflection 318RST, 2016 GMC 3500 Denali SRW Duramax, Hensley BD3 air bag hitch

  5. #5
    Rolling Along cookinwitdiesel's Avatar
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    I would get the generator from the factory and then install your own solar/inverter setup. With a good setup, the inverter can trigger the generator if loads go too high or batteries go too low - this is how I am set up.

    Plan on reliably getting about 60-75% of the rated output from your panels, for 5-6 hours a day. More than that will be rare.

    If you just want to be able to do some basic overnights here and there and not live off-grid in your trailer, you will get by fine with 1200w of solar and 2000-3000w inverter. I would get at least 5kWh of LiFePO4 batteries. Batteries will usually be about 50% of the total system cost.

    For a reference point, my setup is considered very high end (2880w solar, 10 kWh Lithium, 5kw Inverter - with plans for a second). My trailer idles around 200w with the res fridge, so that is 4.8 kWh of energy used a day if I am not even in the trailer. That would take about 1200w on the roof just to break even in decent weather. Truck charging (even a lowly 12v @ 30a - 360w) makes a huge difference in what you have available to use at the end of the day when you park - especially if you drive after the sun is down. Feel free to PM me if you want to get into the nitty gritty. There are some great FB groups as well including one that is GD specific which I am a moderator in.

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    2019 GMC Sierra 3500HD Denali Diesel DRW (Crew Cab | 8 Ft bed | OEM Puck System | Curt Gooseneck Ball for OEM Puck | Timbrens on rear axle)
    2019 Grand Design Solitude S-Class 3740BH-R Fifth Wheel (Onan 5500W LP Generator | MORryde CRE3000 and HD Shackles/Wet Bolts | 3x MORryde Cross Members | 8k Axles and Disc Brakes | Sailun S637 ST | Reese GooseBox 20k 2nd Gen | Splendide Stackable Washer and Dryer)
    Full Suite of Victron Energy Products (2x 5k 24v Quattro Inverter/Charger | 2x 25.6/200 LFP Smart LiFePO4 Batteries | 2880w of Solar Panels across 4x MPPTs | Cerbo GX)

  6. #6
    Site Sponsor SolarPoweredRV's Avatar
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    I agree with a lot of what CookinwitDiesel said above.

    My question to you is: how committed to the residential fridge are you?

    If you are open to the RV fridge as an option your Electrical requirements get much simpler when you consider boondocking.

    From experience, I can tell you that the 300 Watt Factory Solar option will not generate enough power for your needs (especially with a Residential Fridge).

    You have mentioned three very high electric demand requirements: 1) Residential Fridge, 2) High Furnace usage (RV Furnaces are real Energy Hogs), 3) Potential Air Conditioning requirements.

    Have you considered the noise your Factory Generator will make while you are running it? You don't want to be "That Guy" who runs his Generator early in the morning, or too late in the evening.

    You will also want to consider that you may get addicted to Boondocking and want to stay out for a week or longer from time to time.

    Let's talk about heating, like you, I can't sleep if it is too cold (below 70). I am amazed at how much energy the RV furnace draws from my battery bank (so much so, that I doubled the size of my initial Tesla battery bank).

    Also, you should consider the cost and fuel requirements of relying on your Generator very often. You will have two high demand Propane requirements, Heating the RV and Running the Generator. You will be filling your Propane tanks quite often with both of those running fairly often.

    I would reccommend a fairly robust Solar System with a large Lithium Battery Bank for what you have stated as your needs. I also think if you intend on operating your Air Conditioner for more than a couple of hours while Boondocking you should also get the Factory Installed Generator. I also recommend getting a 3000 Watt (or more) Inverter that can power your entire rig (both Electric legs), this will give you 120 volts in every outlet and will let you run your Air Conditioners (for a couple of hours with a large enough battery bank) and your Microwave whenever you want.

    Here is where my recommendations come from: We have 1,200 Watts of Solar and approx 800 amp hours of Battery storage, we also have an RV refrigerator which we run principally on Propane. In February, this year, we took a cross country trip from Florida to Arizona (Phoenix and Quartzite). We hit weather conditions from hot to cold (most nights were cold). We also made the trip during Winter which reduced our ability to generate Energy from the Solar Panels. We also had very few days with Shore Power on a six week trip and no energy coming from our truck into the batteries.

    While we had all the energy we needed, both 12 volt and 120 volt, we did experience days where we used more energy than the Solar Panels generated and the voltage on our Battery Bank dropped over sucssessive days. We also used our Generator to provide Air Conditioning, once we returned to Florida, in one of our favorite Boondocking campsites.

    For specific recommendations, based on what you said above, I would recommend between 1,200 and 2,000 Watts of Solar panels and a minimum 500 amp hour Lithium Battery Bank, along with the Factory Generator and a 3,000 Watt Inverter capable of powering both Legs of your coach (convenient if you have a slightly warm evening where you might want to run the bedroom A/C to cool off the bedroom before bedtime). This system would fit your needs quite well, you could also reduce the Solar Wattage and Battery bank size if you wanted to run your Generator more often.

    You mentioned that you were not comfortable with wiring up Solar, however, you are comfortable with wiring your house. Wiring Solar panels and Lithium Batteries is relatively simple 12 volt circuitry that any competent DIYer can accomplish if you chose to tackle (not saying you should, I'm just saying you could if you wanted to).

    If you would like to discuss Solar more, you could PM me.
    David and Peggy
    2019 Ford F350 Lariat, 6.7L Diesel, Dually, Long Bed
    Running with 20k Reese Goosebox (Love It) and Ford Factory "Puck" system.
    Stopping with 8,000 lb Disc Brakes and Titan Hydraulic over Electric Brakes system.
    Powering all this fun with 1200 Watts of Solar, two Tesla, Model S, battery modules, 24 volt Victron Inverter.
    2018 Solitude 310 GK

  7. #7
    Seasoned Camper
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajg617 View Post
    I've been reading the pros and cons of both and/or neither. Retiring in a couple of months and see some long trips over the next couple of years. Want the residential refrig. Not hard to envision staying off grid for a couple of nights in transit due to the length of the trips (and I'm not in any hurry). Spent many a night in rest areas and Walmarts years past, both in RVs and back seat of my truck.

    So, month long trips, stay at a couple of interesting unplanned locations on the way to/from and not necessarily all the time at an rv park - probably most of it though at destination. While visiting, will be staying with our kids, so park the rv off site somewhere? - their driveways won't work for sure. I'm treating this like a second home, but mobile.

    Caveat, portable generators are too heavy for me to lug and connect (I have one at home and it is heavy, even on wheels and especially in snow) - at my age, convenience is key. It's been 20 years since our last RV but I was younger and had 5 kids to help. I'm also intolerant of heat and cold at times (always have been and it varies). For some reason, 70 degrees in summer is too warm, and 70 degrees in winter is too cool. I also need my coffee to go in the morning - my better half even more so!

    That said I'm considering ordering both from the factory. I haven't read any posts where I noticed folks have ordered both. So, looking for opinions and inevitable follow-up of to LiFePO4 or not and what would be involved over and above what the factory delivers if I order both. I'm practicing buying the last RV first here - which in all probability will be true unless a lemon is delivered.
    Thanks in advance,
    AJG
    It sounds like we do the same type of RVing. We're on the roar now for about 11 months. We looked into both quite a bit and we ended up skipping the solar panels and spending the money on many Lithium Ion batteries and a 6.5 Cummins generator instead. And a new converter and inverter. We find that our residential fridge will last for about 2 days as well as watching tvs and running the heater or AC occasionally with our set up. Or we can run everything electric, including an electric oven and a electric skillet at the same time and charg the batteries in a handful of hours with the generator. Also driving about 4 to six hours at a time will keep the residential fridge running fine and the batteries at 13.5V.

    Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

  8. #8
    Site Sponsor ajg617's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
    It sounds like we do the same type of RVing. We're on the roar now for about 11 months. We looked into both quite a bit and we ended up skipping the solar panels and spending the money on many Lithium Ion batteries and a 6.5 Cummins generator instead. And a new converter and inverter. We find that our residential fridge will last for about 2 days as well as watching tvs and running the heater or AC occasionally with our set up. Or we can run everything electric, including an electric oven and a electric skillet at the same time and charg the batteries in a handful of hours with the generator. Also driving about 4 to six hours at a time will keep the residential fridge running fine and the batteries at 13.5V.

    Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
    Where did you put the Cummins? I had read somewhere that it just a bit too large for the typical Onan install location.

  9. #9
    Site Sponsor ajg617's Avatar
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    cookinwitdiesel and SolarPoweredRV, that's some serious solar. Not sure I could justify that investment initially and surely would be intimidated on the install. I guess I'm still trying to figure out exactly how we will use the RV and what we'll eventually migrate into. Prior to joining this forum, the idea of boondocking hadn't really hit the old noggin - with TT always stayed at a campsite - some less enjoyable then others. We won't be full-timing in the near term - too much to do at home base and a pair of canines (large and very protective) to return to. I could see a couple of month-long trips each year, but winterizing in the off-season until we get our RV legs. Seems like the commitment to solar can grow over time if you build your own but if I read correctly, the factory generator would be a good add in the order?

  10. #10
    Rolling Along cookinwitdiesel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ajg617 View Post
    Where did you put the Cummins? I had read somewhere that it just a bit too large for the typical Onan install location.
    Cummins owns Onan. The 6500w model is the exact same size and engine as the 5500w - identical install.

    And for your other comment, yes, if you build it yourself and plan well, it is very easy to have a modular system you can grow over time. Planning it for the end state up front is key so that you do not block spaces you will need later or end up having to replace components you installed as they wont be suitable later on.
    2019 GMC Sierra 3500HD Denali Diesel DRW (Crew Cab | 8 Ft bed | OEM Puck System | Curt Gooseneck Ball for OEM Puck | Timbrens on rear axle)
    2019 Grand Design Solitude S-Class 3740BH-R Fifth Wheel (Onan 5500W LP Generator | MORryde CRE3000 and HD Shackles/Wet Bolts | 3x MORryde Cross Members | 8k Axles and Disc Brakes | Sailun S637 ST | Reese GooseBox 20k 2nd Gen | Splendide Stackable Washer and Dryer)
    Full Suite of Victron Energy Products (2x 5k 24v Quattro Inverter/Charger | 2x 25.6/200 LFP Smart LiFePO4 Batteries | 2880w of Solar Panels across 4x MPPTs | Cerbo GX)

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