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  1. #1
    Site Team Redapple63's Avatar
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    Questions about Westlake 16 inch tires

    1. Does the Westlake tire debacle include the 16 in Load Range E tires?
    2. Westlake (ST 235/80R/16) load rated E tire is 3520@80psi and speed rated L or 75 mph
    3. Equiv Goodyear Endurance load rated E is 3420@80psi and speed rated N or 87mph.

    Even with 400lbs less tire load carrying it is still way enough. They far exceed the axle ratings of 5200lb ea.
    Tires 13680lbs, axles 10400lbs.

    Stick with the Westlake tires a bit more or replace with the Goodyear?

    So far about 2k no problems, but I am having thoughts of disaster.

    Please tell me about your experience with the 16 inch Westlakes.

    Thanks,
    Bill
    2019 GMC 3500 SRW Sierra Denali Duramax
    2020 Reflection 315RLTS

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    Site Team xrated's Avatar
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    From what I've seen and read, both on this forum and lots of others, the "E" rated Westlake tires are the culprit in most of the issues. Personally, I have the "G" rated Westlakes on my Momentum (20,000 lb GVWR trailer) and those are having very few issues. Obviously, it would be a concern to me if I had the "E" rated tires instead of the "G" tires, so in answer to your question; only you can make that decision on what to do, or not do. I would certainly have a good/reliable TPMS system on the trailer tires (I do, even on the G rated ones on my trailer) and I would certainly keep a very close watch on the tires when travelling. Every fuel stop, before travel, after travel....whenever you make a stop, do a visual on the tires as best you can. Check for any abnormalities....bulges/bubbles anywhere on the tires, any indication of the start of tread separation, unusual wear patterns, etc......and of course keep a very close eye on the TPMS and monitor both the pressures and the temperatures of the tires. Personally, I would swap them out for something that has been proven more reliable, but that is just me. I went through the very same thing several years ago with a previous trailer that came with Trailer King brand tires. I towed it home from the dealership (approx. 400 miles) and parked it, then ordered a new set of tires for it and sold the Trailer King tires to a guy that was going to use them on a farm trailer. I did tell him why I was selling them and that I did not feel that they were safe for my application and made sure he knew what he was buying BEFORE he bought them.
    2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
    2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
    2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
    Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing

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    Site Sponsor GeoffnCheri's Avatar
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    I still have the Westlake "E" load range 16" on our 2018 (build date 9/17) and we are not seeing any issues. I check the tire pressure before we tow without exception.

    IIRC, the Westlake load range "E" issue was GD using the tires on rigs which were too heavy for the load range. I believe GD switched to load range G on the heavier rigs a few years ago.
    Geoff and Cheri
    2011 F250 CC 6.7L
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    2018 Reflection 303RLS, Build date 9/2017
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    Site Team Second Chance's Avatar
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    It's kinda like, "All pickups are motor vehicles but not all motor vehicles are pickups." Not everyone has issues with the Westlake tires, but for the vast majority of those who do, it's the load range E tires. The load range G Westlakes seem to be significantly better built than the load range Es.

    Rob
    U.S. Army Retired
    2012 F350 DRW CC LB Lariat PS 6.7
    2020 Solitude 310GK-R, MORryde IS, disc brakes,
    Sailun LRG tires, solar, DP windows, W/D
    (Previously in a Reflection 337RLS)
    Full time since 08/2015

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    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redapple63 View Post
    1. Does the Westlake tire debacle include the 16 in Load Range E tires?
    2. Westlake (ST 235/80R/16) load rated E tire is 3520@80psi and speed rated L or 75 mph
    3. Equiv Goodyear Endurance load rated E is 3420@80psi and speed rated N or 87mph.

    Even with 400lbs less tire load carrying it is still way enough. They far exceed the axle ratings of 5200lb ea.
    Tires 13680lbs, axles 10400lbs.

    Stick with the Westlake tires a bit more or replace with the Goodyear?

    So far about 2k no problems, but I am having thoughts of disaster.

    Please tell me about your experience with the 16 inch Westlakes.

    Thanks,
    Bill
    I have the 16" westlake tires on my 2018 Reflection which has a build date of 10/17 and tire dates are about 8 months prior to that date. I have 15000 miles on them and no issues. I do plan on changing them out in the spring due to some minor cracking in the tread of one tire and that they will be nearly 4.5 years old so have aged out.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

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    Site Team Redapple63's Avatar
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    Thanks all. So far mine look great. I did notice that the pressure this morning before in left my destination to return home, they all read 60 - 65 psi.

    Another question as it relates to cold tore pressure. I filled to 80psi, but my friend and others told me that it is when they ran the Westlakes at 80 is when they went.

    I fully plan to run at 80, but was wondering your thoughts on that. My camping buddy told me to run them around 65.
    2019 GMC 3500 SRW Sierra Denali Duramax
    2020 Reflection 315RLTS

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    Quote Originally Posted by Redapple63 View Post
    Thanks all. So far mine look great. I did notice that the pressure this morning before in left my destination to return home, they all read 60 - 65 psi.

    Another question as it relates to cold tore pressure. I filled to 80psi, but my friend and others told me that it is when they ran the Westlakes at 80 is when they went.

    I fully plan to run at 80, but was wondering your thoughts on that. My camping buddy told me to run them around 65.
    If they are the factory tires, I would run them at the pressure recommended on the official placard (load and tire data) on the left front corner of your trailer.

    Chris
    Chris & Karen
    Fort Collins, CO
    2017 F-350 SRW 6.7 Lariat Value CC LB 4x4
    2018 Solitude 310GK - Sold 7/2023

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    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redapple63 View Post
    Thanks all. So far mine look great. I did notice that the pressure this morning before in left my destination to return home, they all read 60 - 65 psi.

    Another question as it relates to cold tore pressure. I filled to 80psi, but my friend and others told me that it is when they ran the Westlakes at 80 is when they went.

    I fully plan to run at 80, but was wondering your thoughts on that. My camping buddy told me to run them around 65.
    I have been running mine at the 80 PSI as per the placard on the trailer. Per load inflation charts I could run as low a 55 PSI but prefer the safety margin due to the potential poor quality of trailer tires. Truck tires I run per the placard as well when loaded but per the load inflation charts when empty to improve the ride.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

  9. #9
    Site Team xrated's Avatar
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    I run the OEM tires on my Momentum 394M (20,000 lb GVWR). This is a triple axle trailer and each axle has a 7000 lb rating, for a total of 21,000 lbs on a 20,000 lb GVWR trailer. Of course, at least 20% or more is on the pin of the trailer, and if you use the common number of 20% for a pin weight number, that 20,000 lb trailer has 16,000 lbs on the tires/axle. So let's break that down a bit.
    Each tire, when new...and inflated to the 110 psi rating for the tire, will provide 4080 lbs of carrying capacity. Multiply that times the number of tires on the trailer and you have a total of 24,480 lbs.
    If the 20,000 lb trailer has 20% of the weight on the pin, you now 16,000 on the tires (all six of them) and they have a rated load capacity of 24,480. That gives you an "excess" tire load capacity of 8480 lbs total. Divide that number between the 6 tires on the trailer and now you are looking at an "excess" load capacity for each tire of 1413 lbs. That is comes out to right at 35% of the tire load capacity as excess, which of course means that each tire is carrying approx. 65% of it's rated capacity. You will of course exceed the axle capacity of the trailer, both the total and the individual axle capacities....long before you exceed the tire capacities. Having said that, remember, it is VERY UNLIKELY that each axle is carrying the exact same weight....or a totally "balanced" load on the axles. And to go even further, on side of the trailer may be a bit heavier than the other side of the trailer. So you likely will end up with a bit of difference of weight on every single tire/wheel....they simply aren't all the same exact number.

    Having said all that, remember, we are talking about tire load capacity ratings on BRAND NEW tires....AND being inflated to the rated load capacity inflation number, which in the case of the Westlake ST235/80R/16 "G" rated tire, is 110 psi cold pressure. That seems like a very significant amount of excess capacity, and it is...at least in the beginning, when the tires are new. Over the course of time and miles, as tires wear and are of course affected by weathering, ultraviolet light, etc, that load capacity diminishes from the original number of 4080 lbs of capacity. Some have said that you should probably estimate that those diminishing numbers are between 7-10% per year. I'm not sure that there really is a "fixed" number that can be used for calculations of diminished load capacity on a yearly basis. So it seems to me that it might be prudent to assume that 7-10% every year and by the 3rd...maybe 4th year of the tire, be prepared to replace them with new tires in order to continue with a proper amount of load capacity for your trailer. Obviously, every trailer is different on the way it's used.....long trips vs. short trips. Mostly very hot climates vs. colder climates, direct sunlight on the tires when not being used vs. shaded storage areas. How well the tire pressure has been maintained vs. not maintaining the proper pressure when towing. The list probably goes on, but hopefully you get the idea.

    So if you have a trailer with tires on it that are just barely enough load capacity for the load that they are carrying (when new), you may want to change them out even more than every 3rd or 4th year. Because lets face it, if those tires only have let's say 12 to maybe 15% "excess" capacity when new, how long will it take for them to lose that "new load capacity number" and be reduced by that 7-10% annually.....and now you are towing with tires that might just be on the ragged edge of what they will support. Then factor in that maybe you didn't check tire pressure that morning before you left on you 400 mile trip and the temperatures that day got up into the 90 degree range. That scenario I just described is one of the reasons that you see many, many trailers pulled off the roads and Interstates with their 4 way hazard flasher going and someone in the process of changing a tire that has blown out.
    Last edited by xrated; 12-14-2020 at 07:44 AM.
    2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
    2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
    2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
    Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing

    "If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"

  10. #10
    Site Team Redapple63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xrated View Post
    I run the OEM tires on my Momentum 394M (20,000 lb GVWR). This is a triple axle trailer and each axle has a 7000 lb rating, for a total of 21,000 lbs on a 20,000 lb GVWR trailer. Of course, at least 20% or more is on the pin of the trailer, and if you use the common number of 20% for a pin weight number, that 20,000 lb trailer has 16,000 lbs on the tires/axle. So let's break that down a bit.
    Each tire, when new...and inflated to the 110 psi rating for the tire, will provide 4080 lbs of carrying capacity. Multiply that times the number of tires on the trailer and you have a total of 24,480 lbs.
    If the 20,000 lb trailer has 20% of the weight on the pin, you now 16,000 on the tires (all six of them) and they have a rated load capacity of 24,480. That gives you an "excess" tire load capacity of 8480 lbs total. Divide that number between the 6 tires on the trailer and now you are looking at an "excess" load capacity for each tire of 1413 lbs. That is comes out to right at 35% of the tire load capacity as excess, which of course means that each tire is carrying approx. 65% of it's rated capacity. You will of course exceed the axle capacity of the trailer, both the total and the individual axle capacities....long before you exceed the tire capacities. Having said that, remember, it is VERY UNLIKELY that each axle is carrying the exact same weight....or a totally "balanced" load on the axles. And to go even further, on side of the trailer may be a bit heavier than the other side of the trailer. So you likely will end up with a bit of difference of weight on every single tire/wheel....they simply aren't all the same exact number.

    Having said all that, remember, we are talking about tire load capacity ratings on BRAND NEW tires....AND being inflated to the rated load capacity inflation number, which in the case of the Westlake ST235/80R/16 "G" rated tire, is 110 psi cold pressure. That seems like a very significant amount of excess capacity, and it is...at least in the beginning, when the tires are new. Over the course of time and miles, as tires wear and are of course affected by weathering, ultraviolet light, etc, that load capacity diminishes from the original number of 4080 lbs of capacity. Some have said that you should probably estimate that those diminishing numbers are between 7-10% per year. I'm not sure that there really is a "fixed" number that can be used for calculations of diminished load capacity on a yearly basis. So it seems to me that it might be prudent to assume that 7-10% every year and by the 3rd...maybe 4th year of the tire, be prepared to replace them with new tires in order to continue with a proper amount of load capacity for your trailer. Obviously, every trailer is different on the way it's used.....long trips vs. short trips. Mostly very hot climates vs. colder climates, direct sunlight on the tires when not being used vs. shaded storage areas. How well the tire pressure has been maintained vs. not maintaining the proper pressure when towing. The list probably goes on, but hopefully you get the idea.

    So if you have a trailer with tires on it that are just barely enough load capacity for the load that they are carrying (when new), you may want to change them out even more than every 3rd or 4th year. Because lets face it, if those tires only have let's say 12 to maybe 15% "excess" capacity when new, how long will it take for them to lose that "new load capacity number" and be reduced by that 7-10% annually.....and now you are towing with tires that might just be on the ragged edge of what they will support. Then factor in that maybe you didn't check tire pressure that morning before you left on you 400 mile trip and the temperatures that day got up into the 90 degree range. That scenario I just described is one of the reasons that you see many, many trailers pulled off the roads and Interstates with their 4 way hazard flasher going and someone in the process of changing a tire that has blown out.
    Thanks for such a detailed explanation. My tires are Load Range E (3520 at max psi), which exceeds my max axle rating by nearly 1000 pounds (2600 per tire) so very close to 75% capacity.

    Per your logic, which makes sense to me, at my max axle capacity of 5200 per, I could go as low as 60 psi and if I ran at max GVWR, it would increase tire load by about 150 lbs per tire or about 78% of max load or about 62.4 psi.

    I agree with the others that the absolute safest is to run max pressure, it eliminates all this, but what you say makes absolute sense.
    2019 GMC 3500 SRW Sierra Denali Duramax
    2020 Reflection 315RLTS

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