California CVRA Stickers/Weight Fees and Declared Operating Weight Questions

[tomato]

I have determined that the CVRA stickers and higher fees for declared operating weight are required for my 2020 Sierra DRW, unfortunately. I spoke to the CHP Commercial Division to confirm.

My questions for the group. 1) I am calling DMV tomorrow to confirm, but thought I would ask here. Dealer registered the truck originally at "under 10,001 GV operating weight." Standard pickup weight fee shows on my renewal at $308. For those interested, total reg is $1,091! Ridiculous, but another story. Question: If I increase my declared weight to 26,001-30,000 pounds for GCWR, the weight fee is $586. Is that total, or in addition to the $308? I am hoping it replaces the $308...

2) For those that have and pay for the stickers but keep them in the glovebox. Have you been checked and what was the outcome? I don't want to put these things on my truck. Might use my old Autocross door magnets and put them on those...

3) For those that have 1 ton+ trucks that SHOULD have the stickers but have chosen not to pay the extra fees...What has been the outcome of any stops by CHP?

I went through the work to get my non-commercial Class A and just realized this new issue when I received my registration renewal. I can understand $586 in total, but not $586 + $308...That would put my annual total at $1,677!

Thanks!!!

[D2Reid]

I spoke to the CHP Commercial Division to confirm.

I don't know anything about California laws and registration. What I do know is that training about RV's and what the requirements actually are is practically non-existent. So when you contacted the commercial division, I assume they put you into a commercial carrier category and not the RV category. It takes a lot of research and reading to untangle the specifics and too often the clerks we deal with just do what they were told by someone else without a full understanding of what the laws are. But you can't argue with them, they don't get paid enough to put up with any "discussion" from the public.

All I am trying to say here is trust, but verify...

[SolarPoweredRV]

Two questions: 1) are you absolutely sure you are required to have a non-commercial Drivers License? 2) The CV in CVRA probably pertains to Commercial Vehicles and you are Not a Commercial Vehicle.

This brings up another issue: what if the CVRA means your truck is in fact a Commercial Vehicle, however your Drivers License is not a Commercial Drivers License? I can imagine you getting pulled over by a DOT Officer because he thinks you are a Commercial Vehicle (remember the "CV" designation) and he finds out you are operating a Commercial Vehicle without a Commercial Drivers License and you are not following any of the Commercial Regulations (Logbook, stopping at weigh stations, paying commercial fuel taxes, etc.) it would be a real PITA to try to unwind all the regulations sitting on the side of the road and/or from the back seat of his patrol car on your way to your Arraignment.

By-the-way, Police and DOT Officers are not required to have Probable Cause to pull you over in a Commercial Vehicle, they can just do it because they want to, no reason required.

I would find a transportation lawyer and seek his/or her guidance on your Registration.

D2Ried is correct in that the DMV Clerks usually go on "Hearsay" when it comes to actually knowing the regulations.

Good Luck and let us know how it turns out.

[GeoffnCheri]

My understanding of CA registration is based upon unladen weight. If your under 8000# you're a pick up truck. Over 8k and you pay the premium and everything else that requires.

[tomato]

I am indeed certain I need a non-commercial class A. All pickups are registered as commercial in CA. A truck, like my dually, with unladen weight above 8,001 pounds is not even classed as a pickup. It gets CA code "VA" for all other commercial.

[powerscol]

No wonder its called the land of fruits and NUTS. Move to Colorado - we do things simple here.

Just Googled this
https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/uploads/2020/06/dl648.pdf
https://vehq.com/rv-laws-california/

Hope this helps

[TheLexx]

Wait a minute. Unless you're hauling commercially (as in paid transportation) RV owners do NOT need a commercial class A in California. However if you're combined GCVWR is over 26k, you probably need a NON-commercial class A. AFAIK there are no "stickers" you need to keep. The license class is merely designated on your DL.

I have a F450 with registered 14k lbs GVWR. My registration is over $1000 every year. That's because of the weight fees California imposes on our trucks. With a 14k lbs truck, I am allowed to pull a fifth wheel up to 12k lbs without the non-commercial class A DL. In my case our Reflection 28bh is only 11k lbs GVWR so I'm good. However, if your fifth wheel is between 10-15k lbs GVWR, in California you are required to obtain a trailer endorsement known as "Restriction 41". This is what is imprinted on the back of my DL. In my case however, AFAIK once my trailer goes over 12k lbs, I'd need a non-commercial class A. So the Restriction 41 in my case applies only to fifth wheels 10-12k lbs GVWR.

This is from the California Driver's Handbook:


So here's another tricky part. Notice in the Class C box it states you may "drive a 2 axle vehicle with a GVWR of 26,000 lbs or less". And then in the "you may tow" box, it mentions a fifth wheel between 10-15k lbs. It doesn't mention the need for the special trailer permit! And the way these boxes are worded, it suggest you may drive any two axle vehicle vehicle up to 26k lbs GVWR and then tow a fifth wheel up to 15k lbs WITH YOUR CLASS C DL. It's only when your trailer is over 15k lbs GVWR that you need a non-commercial Class A DL regardless of how heavy your pickup truck is (as long as it's under 26k lbs GVWR).

However we know that federal law requires you to get a different DL when you exceed 26k lbs GCVWR. I've had folks state that 26k lb limit is for commercial towing, not RV's.

So which is it? Does the 26k GCVWR limit apply to RV's in California due to Federal law? Because it's not worded as such in their Driver's Handbook.

In my case I'm confident that I'm within my DL class with my current trailer. Anything heavier and I'd probably opt for the non-commercial DL just to be safe.

[sirtate]

Wait a minute. Unless you're hauling commercially (as in paid transportation) RV owners do NOT need a commercial class A in California. However if you're combined GCVWR is over 26k, you probably need a NON-commercial class A. AFAIK there are no "stickers" you need to keep. The license class is merely designated on your DL.

I have a F450 with registered 14k lbs GVWR. My registration is over $1000 every year. That's because of the weight fees California imposes on our trucks. With a 14k lbs truck, I am allowed to pull a fifth wheel up to 12k lbs without the non-commercial class A DL. In my case our Reflection 28bh is only 11k lbs GVWR so I'm good. However, if your fifth wheel is between 10-15k lbs GVWR, in California you are required to obtain a trailer endorsement known as "Restriction 41". This is what is imprinted on the back of my DL. In my case however, AFAIK once my trailer goes over 12k lbs, I'd need a non-commercial class A. So the Restriction 41 in my case applies only to fifth wheels 10-12k lbs GVWR.

This is from the California Driver's Handbook:


So here's another tricky part. Notice in the Class C box it states you may "drive a 2 axle vehicle with a GVWR of 26,000 lbs or less". And then in the "you may tow" box, it mentions a fifth wheel between 10-15k lbs. It doesn't mention the need for the special trailer permit! And the way these boxes are worded, it suggest you may drive any two axle vehicle vehicle up to 26k lbs GVWR and then tow a fifth wheel up to 15k lbs WITH YOUR CLASS C DL. It's only when your trailer is over 15k lbs GVWR that you need a non-commercial Class A DL regardless of how heavy your pickup truck is (as long as it's under 26k lbs GVWR).

However we know that federal law requires you to get a different DL when you exceed 26k lbs GCVWR. I've had folks state that 26k lb limit is for commercial towing, not RV's.

So which is it? Does the 26k GCVWR limit apply to RV's in California due to Federal law? Because it's not worded as such in their Driver's Handbook.

In my case I'm confident that I'm within my DL class with my current trailer. Anything heavier and I'd probably opt for the non-commercial DL just to be safe.

The 26kip rating for a class C seems to occur when the vehicles are for agricultural use...
(A Farmer or employee of a Farmer may...)

The RV use doesn't stipulate that cap...

It does seem, that as long as the tow vehicle weighs more than 4000#, that 15kips is the limit for RV trailers...

It's also important to distinguish between 'For Hire' and not;
An RV delivery service can't play with these exemptions, even though they may have exactly the same equipment because they are For Hire...

Sent from my LM-G900 using Tapatalk

[JCR GD]

I have to pay the CVRA fee because my dually is rated 14000. They don't care that it is only used for towing RV. I find this ridiculous but you can't fight DMV.

After 6 years the total DMV is $688 this year (it was $980 ish in 2014) My guess is you will be in the $1000+ range.

The additional sticker is in the glove box. Never needed or asked for.

There was no choice for me to pay it or not. Sounds like the dealer may have done you a favor but you are also misrepresented to DMV so not sure if DMV has some ability to make you pay corrected amount if/when they find out.

[JCR GD]

CA Lic (in context of RV forum)

Class C allows= Travel trailer up to 10,000lbs. 5th wheel up 12,000lbs.

"Endorsement/Restriction 41" required= Travel trailer over 10,000lbs. 5th wheel over 12,000lbs but under 15,000lbs.

Non-Commercial Class A required= 5th wheel over 15,000lbs.

**All the other stuff/gobbly-goop is ag and commercial related.***