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01-23-2021, 11:57 PM #1
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GD Reflection 278BH + Ram 2500 - payload questions & truck buyers remorse
First time RVer - Bought a GD 278BH 5W and purchased a Ram 2500 today thinking the 2150 lb payload would be enough. Now that I'm doing some calculations I'm realizing I'm cutting it pretty close.
RV specs:
1,325 hitch weight
Payload specs:
2150 lb truck payload (on vehicle sticker)
420 lb family
225 lbs full tank of gas
100 lb 5th wheel hitch (I haven't purchased it yet so could be more)
The factor I don't know is how much the RV cargo will increase the hitch weight. It seems 15% of the weight would go to the hitch so if we put 1,000 pounds in the RV, that will add 150 lbs to the hitch weight and put me over the payload max on the truck.
I have plenty of tow capacity, it seems the font/back axel weight limits have plenty to spare, but I'm very close on payload numbers as described above.
Am I thinking about this correctly? Did I not buy enough truck? I can see how people learn from their mistakes with RVs and tow vehicle buying.
Thanks for any advice you can offer.
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01-24-2021, 12:08 AM #2
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I might be wrong but I thought a full fuel tank is factored in before the payload sticker... So you might get that 225 back.
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01-24-2021, 12:31 AM #3
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Thanks - that makes me feel better. It looks like you're right based on some research. I had it in my mind that full gas tank was NOT included.
What about the batteries on the RV? Grand Design states hitch weight is "Based on average weight of the standard build". I'm wondering if battery is included in their "standard build". I'm thinking the answer is probably no.
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01-24-2021, 03:52 AM #4
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I just looked up the 278BH numbers and it has a GVWR of 10,195 lbs.....so I'm rounding it to 10,200 lbs for the sake of some calculations. A fifth wheel camping trailer, on average, will put 20% of the trailer weight down as pin weight on the truck. If you trailer is loaded to that GVWR number or pretty close to it, you are looking at roughly 2.040 lbs of pin weight on the truck. Some trailers will be above that 20% number...some even as high as 24-25%. Now let's look at the published empty weight of the trailer....which usually doesn't mean much. First, that number is not going to include the weight of the battery or batteries, nor will it include the weight of the propane. It is an "average" number and most times is not terribly realistic. Secondly, no one camps with an empty trailer, so the published number is, like I said....pretty much useless.
Only you know how much stuff you will be loading in the trailer for your camping but whatever you load, the trailer should never exceed the 10,195 lbs....the GVWR. I'm going to guess that the listed empty weight of 8295 lbs, after a battery is installed and the propane tanks are filled, the empty weight will be in the 8425-8450 lb range. So add up the additional 1000 lbs that you used in your example....except that remember, that number should be at least 20% for calculation purposes. So 8450 plus the 1000 lbs of trailer cargo is now 9450. And of course that is then times a minimum of 20%. So I came up with.1890 lbs of pin weight using the 20% of the trailer weight total. Remember, it could even be a little higher...or even just slightly lower, thus the 20% number. So in adding the pin weight (1890 or let's say 1900 lbs) plus the weight of the hitch (150 lbs), plus the weight of the passengers (420 lbs) and you are at 2470 lbs or rounded off....2500 lbs.
And of course if you end up loading the trailer up to the GVWR of the trailer, the 10,195 (10,200 lbs) you will start out with a 2040 lb pin weight, plus your passengers of 420, plus the hitch 150, for a total of 2610 lbs that you are putting on the truck.
Your best bet for true numbers and accuracy, once you get everything ready to go...hitch in the truck, full tank of fuel, and the trailer loaded like it would be when you are ready to go camping (passengers in the truck also), is to head to the nearest CAT scale and get two weights. First one with the truck and trailer ready to go as I just described. Then the second weight of the truck only...still with the passengers and the hitch. From there, you can calculate your pin weight and be able to determine exactly where you are at with all of your weights. You are most likely going to be over the payload numbers for the truck by at least 300 lbs....and maybe more, depending on how much stuff is in the trailer and where it is stored. And remember, if your truck is over the payload number, you are automatically over the GVWR for the truck. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you ask for advice and I've given you some examples of what the numbers might be. The only way to know for sure is to go to a scale and get some accurate numbers.2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing
"If it ain't fast....It ain't Fun"
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01-24-2021, 06:54 AM #5
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GD Reflection 278BH + Ram 2500 - payload questions & truck buyers remorse
Tons of discussions in this group about payload and the validity of the yellow sticker. I have a 2016 Ram 2500 CTD with “yellow sticker payload” of 2119. I pull a 31mb. Can’t remember the hitch weight on that trailer empty but I think it’s between 1830 and 1900. Got it last July. I knew nothing about the panic the yellow sticker can cause until I joined this group and that was the first time I realized “I don’t have enough truck.” But please do a ton of research. My 2016 2500 pulls it great, stops it even better, and I’m well below the weight rating on both my axle’s and by rear tire load rating even though I am beyond my “official payload capacity.”Do what you feel best with for sure. Your piece of mind is what this is about. But I can tell you that I (and many in this group) believe there is more to pulling the trailer than simply adhering to the yellow sticker.
Front what I’ve researched there is really only one difference between my 2016 Ram 2500 and the 3500. The 2500 has coil springs versus leaf in the 3500. Same size front and rear axle, same size tires, etc. and I do t squat at all with the could springs.
One thing I did during my “panic period” was buy the Anderson Ultimate to save some weight. Love that hitch for sure!!
Good luck on making the decision that’s best for you and the family.
Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkLast edited by Rgkeaney; 01-24-2021 at 07:00 AM.
2020 Reflection 31MB
2016 Ram 2500 Cummins
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01-24-2021, 06:59 AM #6
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01-27-2021, 06:18 AM #7
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I know this is Blasphemy on this forum..... but..... Looking into aftermarket options might be worth trying. Rather than taking hit trading for a bigger truck..... also all the number crunching on this post and others like it, are estimates.... try to get the real weights....Looking at" truck specific forums" might be a good place to start..... There are more than a few campers towing with your truck... I'm waiting for it ..... Norm
2019 230RL Reflection ..... 1996 Dodge 2500 Cummins still pulling just as hard as the day I brought her home November 1995...3.6 Onan. 2 battleborns 300 watts solar, 1500 watt aims inverter....(Convictions are a far greater foe of truth than lies) {Nietztche}
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01-27-2021, 11:04 AM #8
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@xrated is coming at things from the right direction... but he's a Momentum owner and used to toy haulers (which put a little less of the GVWR on the pin due to the garage and contents in the back). The Reflection fifth wheels will put more like 23% of the loaded weight on the pin, so your Reflection 278BH will probably end up at a pin weight of about 2,300 lbs. or a little over. Here's a good tool for doing the calculations:
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-...eight-fw.shtml
RobU.S. Army Retired
2012 F350 DRW CC LB Lariat PS 6.7
2020 Solitude 310GK-R, MORryde IS, disc brakes,
Sailun LRG tires, solar, DP windows, W/D
(Previously in a Reflection 337RLS)
Full time since 08/2015
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01-27-2021, 11:34 AM #9
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01-27-2021, 01:16 PM #10
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The trailer UVW vs the pin weight is about 16%, but everyone agrees those numbers are somewhat unreliable to begin with. So I guess it all depends on how it's loaded up but it seems like the pin weight will end up somewhere between 16-23% then. My plan is to get it all setup with current truck and get it weighed to see where I'm at.
Channging Battery Type?
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