So far not impressed

[Grand_Gord]

We were looking for a down sized RV and saw good reviews on Grand Design. Decided on a XLS 17mke and looked at a few at dealers. Purchased one that was about to be delivered. So far so good.

Get it and start to notice things different or missing. No right side spray port. No spray port hose. No motion sensor lights in cargo bay and entryway. No 30 amp power cord. No small package of toilet chemical. Thats what I've found so far.

Build quality is poor. Recliner sofa wasn't secured to the floor. Sofa had no power to it. Table was a joke. Tilted 2 directions about 20 degrees. Dealer attempted to fix it but in the end basically said thats as good as it gets. I'll take it all out and fix it properly myself.

Sawdust everywhere. Screws found under furniture, in dwars and cupboards.

Dealer is pretty much useless. There answer is Grand Design can't get supplies so dropping what use to be standard equipment.

1 out of 10 I'd score Grand Design as a 3

[Russ Olin]

Understand exactly what you are saying about the Grand Design lower end RV trailers. You have to fix half the stuff yourself & then rebuild the suspension. Or replace the roof.
I bought a 2019 2500RL Imagine & got lucky. Everything worked on it. Ended up selling it to my sister & I went with a brand new 2021 Outdoors RV. If you are looking for better built RV these guys are about as good as it gets in RV trailers with out spending a fortune on excotic models. Such as Oliver or Airstream RV's. They are heavier built, the suspension is already done. You may give them a look. But most dealers are outwest.
Good Luck,
Russ

[Grand_Gord]

I was prepared for basic poor quality and have the skills to fix them all. I will also add the right side spray port. Other side of the wall is the plumbing lines (behind drawers) and the ports are cheap. Under 20 bucks. Same as the motion sensor lights...they're only 15 bucks.

Just amazing Grand Design would cause customer dissatisfaction for miniscule cost cutting. They claim its because of supply shortages but odd all the items are available on Amazon.

Business model building RVs suck. They basically have no I.P. so whoever slaps them together quicker makes profit.

[Dadeo6472]

I hear you. Our 2019 Imagine XLS 18RBE that we bought used (lightly) in early 2020 also had defects and a sloppy mess left behind by the construction process. They left round sawed out wooden plugs that were drilled out for the holes used to pass wires and plumbing. There was sawdust and loose screws hidden behind every service panel and under every cabinet. Duplicate parts for the roof top radio and TV antenna were left under the stove. The wiring around the converter and fuse box is disorganized and not labeled; it resembles a bowl of spaghetti. There is so much extra wiring left behind someone else could wire another trailer. Wiring strain relief is close to non existent. God help anyone who tries to trace a faulty circuit. Defects included a kinked hot water line exiting the hot water heater, a heater duct that was supposed to heat the underbelly, but was left flopping around on the floor heating the fridge, and, wires to the tongue jack that ran unshielded thru sharp edged holes in the metal trailer frame. They shorted out as they were cut by the sharp edges but the fuse for the trailer jack never blew. The fuse was located at the trailer jack end of the wire, instead of the battery end. This one could have caused a fire.

On the bright side, the only thing that has actually failed was the tongue jack. Everything else has worked from day one.

Our dealer is merely OK. They never figured out that the starter battery for the generator they sold me was faulty. I had to.

[NB Canada]

I was prepared for basic poor quality and have the skills to fix them all. I will also add the right side spray port. Other side of the wall is the plumbing lines (behind drawers) and the ports are cheap. Under 20 bucks. Same as the motion sensor lights...they're only 15 bucks.

Just amazing Grand Design would cause customer dissatisfaction for miniscule cost cutting. They claim its because of supply shortages but odd all the items are available on Amazon.

Business model building RVs suck. They basically have no I.P. so whoever slaps them together quicker makes profit.

Mine was missing the motion lights and a quick call to GD I had them shipped to Canada and in my hands in 6 days

Covid wasn’t Grand Designs fault btw


2021 Imagine 2400 BH
2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew 1840 payload

[Grand_Gord]

I hear you. Our 2019 Imagine XLS 18RBE that we bought used (lightly) in early 2020 also had defects and a sloppy mess left behind by the construction process. They left round sawed out wooden plugs that were drilled out for the holes used to pass wires and plumbing. There was sawdust and loose screws hidden behind every service panel and under every cabinet. Duplicate parts for the roof top radio and TV antenna were left under the stove. The wiring around the converter and fuse box is disorganized and not labeled; it resembles a bowl of spaghetti. There is so much extra wiring left behind someone else could wire another trailer. Wiring strain relief is close to non existent. God help anyone who tries to trace a faulty circuit. Defects included a kinked hot water line exiting the hot water heater, a heater duct that was supposed to heat the underbelly, but was left flopping around on the floor heating the fridge, and, wires to the tongue jack that ran unshielded thru sharp edged holes in the metal trailer frame. They shorted out as they were cut by the sharp edges but the fuse for the trailer jack never blew. The fuse was located at the trailer jack end of the wire, instead of the battery end. This one could have caused a fire.

On the bright side, the only thing that has actually failed was the tongue jack. Everything else has worked from day one.

Our dealer is merely OK. They never figured out that the starter battery for the generator they sold me was faulty. I had to.

Our last RV was a 40 foot Discovery pusher. Wiring on it was interesting with Fleetwood on the living portion and Freightliner on the chassis. Had the wipers quit working once and both claimed the schematic belonged to the other. Finally found a harness bundle under the dash with about 8 bosh style relays. No indication what any were for. By switching them spot to spot finally found the dead wiper relay.

As for manufacturing leaving trash everywhere...no idea why they allow that. Every RV owner ends up screwing around the hidden areas for some reason and finding extra bits and trash just sends a bad message on quality. Literally 30 seconds to clean up when building...just a dumb business model to omit it.

[rmaly76]

My dinette table I got with the telescoping legs was tons better than on my old Winnebago. If it is the same as the one in the 21bhe, I'm not sure how there can be 20 deg of flex but would definitely expect a fix under warrantee. I did add a felt pad to the end so it wouldn't wear down the sidewall upon raise and lower. I feel your aggravation on that. I have red many of the power sofas come unplugged. PIA to plug back in, so I've been told (none such equipment on my 21bhe). But if its as simple as it needed to be plugged in, not sure that is even worth mentioning. If there is something beyond a fuse or a plug, again, I feel your aggravation on that.

Beyond that, I'm feeling that there was a failure on the part of your dealer to do appropriate PDI. 30 amp cord? I assume you didn't leave the dealer with a trailer and without a cord. Did they not even do a walk through with it hooked up? I can't imagine a dealer that wouldn't have that on hand. They may have chosen to ship the trailer without a quick connect spray hose if there is a supply issue and if that was indeed the case, I'd bet it would be shipped direct to you once available. I would much rather have a trailer in my hands without a hose, than no trailer at all.

Saw dust should have been cleaned out by your dealer and even if it was, my Winnebago rained sawdust from one hole for most of the weekend trips over our 2 year ownership. Kind of got to the point where I thought it was funny how long it lasted. Every single maker I looked at had running design changes.

I knew the passanger side spray port had been discontinued. I wish GD would do a better job of keeping their on-line literature up to date because that is the single biggest disappointment I had although I have heard that to be a problem area for leaks. Do they keep a poor design and have someone bitch that it doesn't work or leak, or do they remove problem areas as they are identified as such? I give them slack for making a decision that will make some happy and others pissed. I too will be under consideration of re-plumbing to add back the lost spray port.

Tank chemical? Didn't even know you should expect this with a trailer. I see that as a maintenance item buyer responsibility.

I'm 2 months in and Grand Design has sent me a survey on inital build quality and does have a dealer question. I hope you get it fixed to your liking whether by you or dealer. Good luck to you.

[rmaly76]

Sounds like some of the same issues and was appropriately address by GD customer service per poster...

https://www.mygrandrv.com/forum/show...069#post340069

[Grand_Gord]

My dinette table I got with the telescoping legs was tons better than on my old Winnebago. If it is the same as the one in the 21bhe, I'm not sure how there can be 20 deg of flex but would definitely expect a fix under warrantee. I did add a felt pad to the end so it wouldn't wear down the sidewall upon raise and lower. I feel your aggravation on that. I have red many of the power sofas come unplugged. PIA to plug back in, so I've been told (none such equipment on my 21bhe). But if its as simple as it needed to be plugged in, not sure that is even worth mentioning. If there is something beyond a fuse or a plug, again, I feel your aggravation on that.

Beyond that, I'm feeling that there was a failure on the part of your dealer to do appropriate PDI. 30 amp cord? I assume you didn't leave the dealer with a trailer and without a cord. Did they not even do a walk through with it hooked up? I can't imagine a dealer that wouldn't have that on hand. They may have chosen to ship the trailer without a quick connect spray hose if there is a supply issue and if that was indeed the case, I'd bet it would be shipped direct to you once available. I would much rather have a trailer in my hands without a hose, than no trailer at all.

Saw dust should have been cleaned out by your dealer and even if it was, my Winnebago rained sawdust from one hole for most of the weekend trips over our 2 year ownership. Kind of got to the point where I thought it was funny how long it lasted. Every single maker I looked at had running design changes.

I knew the passanger side spray port had been discontinued. I wish GD would do a better job of keeping their on-line literature up to date because that is the single biggest disappointment I had although I have heard that to be a problem area for leaks. Do they keep a poor design and have someone bitch that it doesn't work or leak, or do they remove problem areas as they are identified as such? I give them slack for making a decision that will make some happy and others pissed. I too will be under consideration of re-plumbing to add back the lost spray port.

Tank chemical? Didn't even know you should expect this with a trailer. I see that as a maintenance item buyer responsibility.

I'm 2 months in and Grand Design has sent me a survey on inital build quality and does have a dealer question. I hope you get it fixed to your liking whether by you or dealer. Good luck to you.

Our 17mke doesn't have a dinette it has the recliner sofa with a table bracket on the front face. Something was odd with this trailer...it looked like they just tossed the sofa in and shipped it. None of the wiring worked, wasn't actually secured to the floor, just sitting there. Found the screws needed to secure it laying under the sofa.

Toilet chemical is a very minor thing. They use to give a small starter package but claim because of covid they can't get it. Same with spray port hose. On the hose just an odd response. We can't get them so not including? I can buy one so not sure why they can't. Can you imagine buying a new F150 and being told they can't get rear door handles so simply omitting them?

Having said my complaints, we do like the layout and feels big for a tiny RV. And I'm in the aerospace industry so extremely fussy on quality. I'll make all the changes, fix all the flaws and it'll probably be just fine. Its an industry problem not unique to Grand Design. Similar build quality to a 70's American automobile. The industry sucks at quality control.

[Dadeo6472]

The industry sucks at quality control. The fact is that the industry is incestuous. Its like Detroit in the 1960s. Designers, managers, labor are all basically the same and they move from company to company at will. And with such high demand, who cares who is hired, how well it fits, whether it will work next year, or if it shorts out or rattles. Who cares if we are wasting supplies and leaving a pile of trash near the furnace intake? Just get that thing out of the factory by noon. It's all consolidated around Indiana and there is no real competition from abroad. Its all led to a complacent culture. I get paid piecework. Man, can I just get out of here and back to the farm by 2:00? What a joke.