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  1. #1
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    Froze Up, I Think

    I just bought a 30 foot 2021 Image 2600RB trailer last month. I full time and work in Kansas. Its 8 degrees outside and the only running water I have is cold coming from the kitchen sink, no hot water anywhere. I'm using the water in the fresh water tank, the water pump is working since I have water in the kitchen sink. Up until this cold spell I had hot and cold water everywhere. I've had several campers through the years but this is my first Grand Design. I think the fresh water tank is located under the kitchen sink somewhere and this is probably why I have cold water in the kitchen and the water pump is under the kitchen sink. So what is keeping the cold water from reaching the bathroom sink, toilet and shower from the pump and kitchen? Since there is no cold water getting to the bathroom means there's no water pressure for the hot water to be pushed through the hot water lines. Does this sound correct? I've had electric heaters blowing hot air under both kitchen and bathroom sinks which isn't helping. Question, the water lines from the kitchen (cold water to the bathroom and hot water coming back from the hot water tank) going back to the bathroom, are they in a heated duct or plenum? Is there a check valve somewhere that's keeping the cold water from reaching the bathroom and hot water tank and shower? Does Grand Design have a troubleshooting telephone number for assistance? Thanks for any input!!

  2. #2
    Paid my dues 😁 FT4NOW's Avatar
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    Are you using the furnace along with the electric heaters? If you don't run the furnace, you wont provide any heat to the underbelly which would explain the freezing.

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  3. #3
    Site Team Ynot4me2's Avatar
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    What @FT4NOW said. Its your furnace that heats the underbelly where your tanks and pipes are so if its not coming on then the underbelly is not getting heat. Is your hot water heater also on? So if I understand your situation, you only have cold water in the kitchen and neither hot or cold in the bathroom.

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    Thanks for the reply. I have been running the furnace along with the electric heaters. According to the brochure it appears the underbelly is heated which makes me think the water lines are not frozen but theres something else stopping the cold water from getting from the water pump located in the kitchen to the bathroom where the hot water heater is located. Plus theres no cold water back at the bathroom also. I look at the water pump and theres a white hose with blue stripes going from the pump into the and under the floor and appearing to going back to the bathroom. Under the bathroom sink there is a white hose with blue stripes coming up from the floor and splits. One split sends cold water to the water heater and another split goes to the bathroom sink and a third split goes to the shower. I'm thinking the 15 foot white and blue striped hose coming off the pump is blocked, maybe with a check valve, cutting off cold water to the bathroom and hot water heater. I'm hoping this is not the case because this would be a bad design putting a valve in the duct to where you can't get to it without tearing up a lot of stuff. I'm kind of at a loss on this.

  5. #5
    Rolling Along Buckskin's Avatar
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    Check air ducts coming out of air handler. My 2018 2250RK air duct tube was just hanging from air handler and not routed through hole in floor below air handler. I routed air duct tube through hole in floor to heat underbelly. Also electric heaters may prevent furnace from running enough to keep underbelly warm enough. I can only image at 8 degrees how hard it would be to keep underbelly water lines from freezing even if everything was perfect. You also may need to put a 1,000 watt quartz work light in cargo bay to help keep water lines there warm, make sure it has good clearance from other objects in cargo bay. Cargo bay is where my pump is located and not sure on yours.
    Last edited by Buckskin; 02-08-2021 at 03:28 PM.

  6. #6
    Seasoned Camper Chewwi's Avatar
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    Furnace only heats the underbelly when itís running. And it only runs when the thermostat senses the inside space is below itís setpoint. The electric heaters might be maintaining the inside space warm enough to let the furnace run.

    I suspect your problem is a frozen line. The check valve is on the discharge from the pump. Since you have cold water in the sink from the pump, the check valve is not blocking flow.

    Google Grand Design customer service to get their phone number.

  7. #7
    Site Team Ynot4me2's Avatar
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    Have you checked the bypass valves on the hot water tank to insure that they are not all closed and in the correct position. They don't move by the self but if the bottom was accidentally closed that could explain. Also, when its below freezing, you should only be running the furnace to ensure the underbelly gets heated up properly. Running electric reduces the amount of times the furnace kicks on. Here's hoping you lines aren't frozen and busted. You'll know for sure when things thaw out. Get that furnace going to heat the underbelly.

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  8. #8
    Site Team D2Reid's Avatar
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    Tonight, open all of the cabinet doors, all of them. Put your propane furnace temp up higher than you would normally, lower your electric heaters.

    Sounds strange? Hmm! to explain. You don't have a very big camper. Opening all of the cabinets allows cabin temperature air to infiltrate the little hidden pockets behind the cabinets. It doesn't take much of a freeze to stop the water lines. But once stopped, they are stopped. It also takes about 8 hours to unfreeze a water line (unless direct heat is applied to the spot). So, Opening the cabinets allows cabin warm air to penetrate, over night allows enough time for those line to warm up and that a bit.

    In the morning try the bathroom water, if you get a little bitty trickle then you have made progress, you know you have/had a frozen line. Capitalize on that by leaving the water trickle, the warmer water from the tank will eventually cause the little ice spot to melt even more quickly, LOL, I say quickly, 8 hours of trickle. The warmer the inside air the faster the melt.

    Some more bad news. I am not a small trailer guy so don't know the specifics, but a few years ago there was a big hoohaa about some water lines being run below the insulation but on top of the coraplast causing the lines to freeze. They had to open up the belly of the beast and rerun the water lines inside of the insulation, I don't know if that is your problem, but it has happened in the past.

    8 is pretty chilly. That's the time these problems appear. Hopefully you will get some above freezing temperatures and the problem will go away, until the next "hard freeze".

    Hopefully you are on full hook up, if so, I am hesitant to add this next part, it is fraught with danger. Ok, here goes; the big thing here is keeping a smooth flow of water from the ground through the rv back into the ground. At any point if there is a blockage it's possible to make a very horrible frozen mess that would require the rv to be placed inside a warm building to unfreeze. But, if you can get a smooth unrestricted flow of water that water will melt any blockages.

    I'll have to tell you the story about the icicles coming out of the kitchen slide sometime....

    Ok, more good news. The plastic piping that they are using today of pretty freeze tolerant. I have frozen some water lines, fearing I have burst them and was getting ready for mega water leak/damage scenario, but no, they froze, they thawed, they didn't break. I am not saying you may not suffer a subsequent water leak due to freezing, I am just saying that it is less likely in todays world than it was 20 years ago....

    Please keep us posted on your adventure. Everyone want to know the root cause of your problems. This is how we learn, by sharing our adversities...
    Dallas
    2017 Momentum 376TH, 2019 Ford F450, Dual Rear Wheel, 4x4, diesel.
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  9. #9
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    I figured out on mine it would start freezing at the low point drains and creep up to the tee effectively blocking both the cold and hot water. I bought a $10 aluminum clamp on flood light housing and a red heat lamp bulb then clamped it to the stabilizer jack, about a foot away from the low point drains. I had water in about 30 minutes!
    Before I got to that point, I had already placed a small space heater near the nautilus system and removed the side panel to expose the plumbing. I added heat trace and insulation to the end of my heated hose to protect the tap.
    Almost forgot about the heat trace on my slinky hose and exposed pvc lines. That is a necessity if you keep your grey water valve open. Luckily when mine froze up it was mostly shower water in the line. The slinky hose broke in half when I jiggled it to see if I could get the water to drain.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by campingfeen View Post
    Thanks for the reply. I have been running the furnace along with the electric heaters. According to the brochure it appears the underbelly is heated which makes me think the water lines are not frozen but theres something else stopping the cold water from getting from the water pump located in the kitchen to the bathroom where the hot water heater is located. Plus theres no cold water back at the bathroom also. I look at the water pump and theres a white hose with blue stripes going from the pump into the and under the floor and appearing to going back to the bathroom. Under the bathroom sink there is a white hose with blue stripes coming up from the floor and splits. One split sends cold water to the water heater and another split goes to the bathroom sink and a third split goes to the shower. I'm thinking the 15 foot white and blue striped hose coming off the pump is blocked, maybe with a check valve, cutting off cold water to the bathroom and hot water heater. I'm hoping this is not the case because this would be a bad design putting a valve in the duct to where you can't get to it without tearing up a lot of stuff. I'm kind of at a loss on this.
    Thanks to D2Reid..Boucon..Ynot4me2..Chewwi (where in South Carolina are you? I lived in Summerville and still have kids down there)..Buckskin..FT4Now..Everyone had great ideas and ideas I never heard of, like the low point drain freezing, putting heat tape on the sewer discharge pipe and the water lines being under the belly insulation. I wasnt getting anywhere on thawing out my brand new grand design so I parked it into a heated rv repair garage. 18 hours later the rv tech had it thawed out, everything is working and no busted pipes. I told him to go ahead and winterized the camper, I'm done winter camping for now. The tech told me the hot and cold lines running from the pump, which is mid trailer and under the kitchen sink, back to the hot water heater in the bathroom had frozen. These pipes are about 15 feet long and in a heated duct, I'm assuming. I might be a little guilty of running to much electric heater vs the furnace but once I started freezing up I did start using the furnace more but apparently to late, it never got unfrozen. I called GD and talked with a warranty guy, he said he hates the term "Artic Package" or all season camper. We started talking about the testing procedures to get the artic package label on the camper. As I suspected, GD along with just about every other rv manufacture, the camper gets up into a freezer for eight hours, the they go in the camper and make sure the furnace, ac, radio, tv, water pump still work..thats it, test complete. I told the GD guy I thought the the artic package was misleading because a eight hour test is not enough. He kind of agreed with me but understandably doesnt want to dog the company thats paying him! I'm guessing that if I wanted to take this camper winter camping in the Wyoming back country I'd have to keep the furnace running 24/7. Thats my story, a little less electric heater and more furnace or head south for the winter! Thanks for all you help and positive attitude and answers. Be careful out there.

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