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  1. #41
    Commercial Member huntr70's Avatar
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    Just so everyone is on the same page here, most of this is running model changes, not lack of parts.

    All of these items were planned by the Solitude team for release.

    Bad part is, we as dealers do not know of the changes, or when they take affect. I'm sure I will have some customers that ordered a Solitude and expected tan exterior, and it's going to come in white. Can I do anything about it? Nope.

    That is the exact reason they run the disclaimer at the bottom of their brochures and website.

    On the bright side, if a customer does not want that unit, it now becomes a stock piece that I didn't have before....
    Steve- Inventory Manager at Tom Schaeffer's RV, Shoemakersville, PA www.tomschaeffers.com
    [email protected]
    2011 RAM 3500 SRW Outdoorsman Edition 4X4, 6.7 Cummins--TWEAKED!
    2021 Reflection 310RLS

  2. #42
    Seasoned Camper Cenerus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RV Sailor View Post
    Glad you ordered a new one as you should as you weren’t satisfied. I hope the next one meets your expectations.

    While I have to agree that all the items are piddly complaints for me save the water heater , every person is different, and decides what is a unforgivable oversight . It also doesn’t mean as you inferred to Da Breeze we don’t have high standards. Maybe you didn’t mean it that way I hope,

    I am also wondering why you feel qualified to need to determine the reasons for the changes that GD has made and why you feel in almost every case it’s because they are overproducing or scraping the bottom of the barrel. You seem to think or infer because you spent a lot of money that your quality from the same manufacturer as mine is should be better than my “ cheap” Imagine. The manufacturer I hope doesn’t take what you spent into account , that you spent whatever you did on the Solitude and therefore should pay extra special attention to you over the rest of the models. I think your 4 changes in 5 years of TT speaks volumes. Perhaps you set your expectation to high. I get the sense you’ll be back here complaining about the next trailer you got from GD. Thing is the other TT manufacturers are similar I believe. If the next one doesn’t meet you standards I hope you stay involved in RV but try a different manufacturer. I am very satisfied with what I got. It wasn’t perfect but it also could be upgraded by me. I didn’t expect it to be perfect, but the MAJOR important components were. I could overlook a different color shower head and replace it. I could get different blinds and replace it. A cup holder really isn’t a deal breaker no matter how stupid that decision was ( and it is). I’d find a work around not kill the deal. I’d get them to replace the hot water heater.

    Honestly I think many of us understand that TT are not build to the same standards as houses . It shouldn’t even be compared. I have a 35 ft sailboat and it’s build quality is light years better than any TT. I think many of us have accepted that FACT. I knew that going in to my RV adventure. The builders of these things don’t have the same quality control as say my sailboat builder. Course $90,000 won’t buy you a 35 ft sailboat or even come close. I was amazed at the nest of wiring and out of control runs of some of the plumbing. It’s no different on the Solitude, I looked.

    The marine industry does not use cheap fusion appliances, everything is quality grade stainless steel. They would never think of using plywood on framing. I could go on and on. But I’ve accepted that’s the way the RV whole industry builds. Except maybe an Airstream. But maybe that gets more people into RVing. I have accepted it going in. Knowing that I choose to not over-invest in my TT. My sailboat is over 30 yers old, half its life, still looks and performs great. But I paid for that. My “ cheap Imagine” will not even last 15 years I bet.

    My point is think about your expectations from an industry not known for quality control. GD maybe have more than others. GD has good customer service it seems. But it’s a TT and know how their built and I don’t get frazzled about it and not let it get in the way of enjoying the outdoors and traveling. Enjoy your time in it.

    Sorry to others for my diatribe.
    Fair enough RV Sailor. I've had really good success with GD so far, so I was caught off guard by the number of things in the 310GK that I saw that were not pleasant surprises. You're right that I'm making some assumptions about GD that I can't back up. I was trying to puzzle out why they would mismatch bathroom fixtures in a way that looks pretty bad, or put an obviously rusty water heater in a brand new trailer. I think you summed it up perfectly in your post. The RV industry doesn't have the quality control of the marine or home industries. GD has better customer service than their competition, but they still make their trailers the same way the others do. My expectations of GD are much more realistic now. I'm still a loyal customer and looking forward to the new trailer I have on order. I'll also be much more reasonable with them given that they are an RV manufacturer and not a boat builder.
    Jesse & Anita
    2021 Solitude S-Class 2930RL-R
    2020 Chevy Silverado 3500 long bed SRW, Duramax Diesel. B&W Companion hitch on B&W turnover goose ball

  3. #43
    Rolling Along
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    Just for provoke additional thought. I would agree the items identified (sans the water heater) are relatively minor, and the industry as a whole does not have the same quality control (or quality concerns, quite frankly) as other industries. Having said that, nothing will ever change if we just keep accepting it. I initially responded with a suggestion about having the dealer make swaps with stuff that's on site, but I've had a change of heart, and Im with the OP. Don't accept it.. make them send you a new one. Granted, you don't know that the new one will come with these areas addressed, or may have other issues.. who knows. BUT, as consumers, we continue to accept sub-standard stuff, and as a result, nothing changes.

    I think too many times, people are willing to just accept it, fix the issues themselves, and move on. I am guilty of the same. But all that does is encourage the same behavior and is a disincentive to change.

    Will it change next week, next month, next year.. probably not. But maybe, sometime in the future, someone will look back and say, "I sure am glad people stopped accepting crap and glad to see the RV industry has finally changed"

    Mike
    Im Mike Willoughby, and I approve this message.
    2017 Ram 3500 CTD (aka FRAM)
    2019 Grand Design Reflection 367BHS

  4. #44
    Left The Driveway Danbo5's Avatar
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    our 382wb came in without the recliner tables and with the brushed nickle shower fixture...won't know about window shades till our walk thru Monday. Oddly...it's the shades we care most about..

  5. #45
    Seasoned Camper Cenerus's Avatar
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    I have another Solitude on order now. While I'm waiting I went to my dealer to look at some Solitudes that came in recently. We looked at four solitudes of differnet shapes and sizes. All of them had a mish mosh of fixtures, window shades, theater seats and mattresses. None had the shower fixture they advertise on the website. They either had that chrome shower fixture, or the shower fixture out of a Solitude S-Class or a brushed nickel shower head that looks like the one from a reflection. We also noticed that the mattresses in the bedrooms were all differnent. Some were hard as a rock and others were quite nice memory foam. Some had theater seats with the side tables, some had no little tables like ours that we rejected had and on a single cup holder. It really seems that Grand Design is having parts problems.

    While we were out looking we also looked at some Keystone Montana's. All of the Montana's, I repeat ALL of them had exactly the fixtures, seating, window shades that are on the website. Nothing was substituted. Also, none of them had anything that seems messed up like a rusty water heater or a door that wouldn't close. They had the same fit and finish of a Solitude. They also had a maxair fan in the bathroom. Something I really wish Grand Design would do. Now Keystone is owned by Thor and Grand Design is owned by Winnebago. So perhaps Thor has a better supply chain than Winnebago does and they have less of a parts problem. But I found this interesting that the issues I saw with the Soliltudes didn't seem to be there in some of their competitor's trailers. If I didn't already know and respect Grand Design for their customer service, I would have walked away thinking that Keystone was the premium brand and Grand Designs were kind of slapped together. This only applied to the full Montana compared to the full Solitude. The Montana High Country doesn't hold a candle to the Solitude S-Class. In fact, I think the Montana High Country doesn't even compare to my reflection in terms of fit, finish and materials. I think the only Keystone that seems to compare head to head to Grand Design is the full Montana versus the Soliltude. It's a sharp steep dropoff in quality to the next level down for Keystone.
    Jesse & Anita
    2021 Solitude S-Class 2930RL-R
    2020 Chevy Silverado 3500 long bed SRW, Duramax Diesel. B&W Companion hitch on B&W turnover goose ball

  6. #46
    Seasoned Camper
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cenerus View Post
    I have another Solitude on order now. While I'm waiting I went to my dealer to look at some Solitudes that came in recently. We looked at four solitudes of differnet shapes and sizes. All of them had a mish mosh of fixtures, window shades, theater seats and mattresses. None had the shower fixture they advertise on the website. They either had that chrome shower fixture, or the shower fixture out of a Solitude S-Class or a brushed nickel shower head that looks like the one from a reflection. We also noticed that the mattresses in the bedrooms were all differnent. Some were hard as a rock and others were quite nice memory foam. Some had theater seats with the side tables, some had no little tables like ours that we rejected had and on a single cup holder. It really seems that Grand Design is having parts problems.

    While we were out looking we also looked at some Keystone Montana's. All of the Montana's, I repeat ALL of them had exactly the fixtures, seating, window shades that are on the website. Nothing was substituted. Also, none of them had anything that seems messed up like a rusty water heater or a door that wouldn't close. They had the same fit and finish of a Solitude. They also had a maxair fan in the bathroom. Something I really wish Grand Design would do. Now Keystone is owned by Thor and Grand Design is owned by Winnebago. So perhaps Thor has a better supply chain than Winnebago does and they have less of a parts problem. But I found this interesting that the issues I saw with the Soliltudes didn't seem to be there in some of their competitor's trailers. If I didn't already know and respect Grand Design for their customer service, I would have walked away thinking that Keystone was the premium brand and Grand Designs were kind of slapped together. This only applied to the full Montana compared to the full Solitude. The Montana High Country doesn't hold a candle to the Solitude S-Class. In fact, I think the Montana High Country doesn't even compare to my reflection in terms of fit, finish and materials. I think the only Keystone that seems to compare head to head to Grand Design is the full Montana versus the Soliltude. It's a sharp steep dropoff in quality to the next level down for Keystone.
    We have also been out looking for a new RV and thought we'd look in the Montana's as well. From what we saw of the Montana's in our area, they had terrible fit and finish. Drawer fronts crooked, ALL of the trim had staples either sticking out or gobbed with putty. Storage doors that had gaps of rubber gasket missing. One had a kitchen sink drain, not even attached! Some had build dates of DEC 2020 and JAN 2021. I know that manufacturers are rushing to get these things built and most things would hopefully caught be a during a thorough PDI, but sad to see them arrive on a dealers lot this way, no matter the manufacturer.

    When we went to look at the Solitudes, the fit and finish was better, but when you start looking closer, you can see the fit and finish has fallen some too. You can see substitutions that have been put in different units we saw, such as some chrome shower heads with bronze sink fixtures, which is a head scratcher, but still better than the old faucet that you couldn't even get you hands under to wash them. We even saw one 390RK with the same shower head we had in our Reflection.

    Even with these changes, we are still wanting to order one, but we are still trying to dial in that "forever, at least for today" floor plan.
    Last edited by Pawsitive Camping Life; 03-24-2021 at 09:27 AM. Reason: spelling
    Former 2022 Solitude 310GKR w/8K axles & disc brakes, factory solar
    Formerly 2019 Reflection 230RL, 2019 Reflection 320MKS, and 2015 Outback Terrain 230TRS

  7. #47
    Seasoned Camper Cenerus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pawsitivedivetraining View Post
    We have also been out looking for a new RV and thought we'd look in the Montana's as well. From what we saw of the Montana's in our area, they had terrible fit and finish. Drawer fronts crooked, ALL of the trim had staples either sticking out or gobbed with putty. Storage doors that had gaps of rubber gasket missing. One had a kitchen sink drain, not even attached! Some had build dates of DEC 2020 and JAN 2021. I know that manufacturers are rushing to get these things built and most things would hopefully caught be a during a thorough PDI, but sad to see them arrive on a dealers lot this way, no matter the manufacturer.

    When we went to look at the Solitudes, the fit and finish was better, but when you start looking closer, you can see the fit and finish has fallen some too. You can see substitutions that have been put in different units we saw, such as some chrome shower heads with bronze sink fixtures, which is a head scratcher, but still better than the old faucet that you couldn't even get you hands under to wash them. We even saw one 390RK with the same shower head we had in our Reflection.

    Even with these changes, we are still wanting to order one, but we are still trying to dial in that "forever, at least for today" floor plan.
    I was out looking at both Solitudes and Montana's this past weekend while I wait for my new Solitude to arrive. If I find something I like more I may just cancel the order and buy one off the lot that meets my expectations. I saw a Solitude S-Class 3550 that had a strange puddle in the bathroom in front of the sink. I opened the sink cupboard and low and behold, the drain was not connected. I asked the sales person about it and he said that the unit just arrived and that it must have left the factory like that. Grand Design doesn't really seem to be inspecting the trailers before they leave Indiana. I'm beginning to suspect that their vaunted inspection process is a thing of the past, or just a quick walkthrough without a real detailed use of the checklist.

    Now to be fair to GD, I saw two Montana High Countries that day that had trim that had fallen off in transit from the factory. But one thing I did notice is that the full Montanas compared well to the full Solitudes. Fit and finish seemed about the same. I hope GD isn't beginning to sink to Thor's level.
    Jesse & Anita
    2021 Solitude S-Class 2930RL-R
    2020 Chevy Silverado 3500 long bed SRW, Duramax Diesel. B&W Companion hitch on B&W turnover goose ball

  8. #48
    Seasoned Camper
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cenerus View Post
    I hope GD isn't beginning to sink to Thor's level.
    I think we all are hoping that isn't the case!
    Former 2022 Solitude 310GKR w/8K axles & disc brakes, factory solar
    Formerly 2019 Reflection 230RL, 2019 Reflection 320MKS, and 2015 Outback Terrain 230TRS

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