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  1. #11
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goducks14 View Post
    Not positive but Ford tells you with the 2020-2021 F150's to only return the front back 25%. Not 100%. In the past it's always been 50% with F150's.
    Almost impossible to get 100 percent back anyway

    For my GMC it comes down almost equally to the ground


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  2. #12
    Big Traveler Calbar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NB Canada View Post
    Almost impossible to get 100 percent back anyway

    For my GMC it comes down almost equally to the ground


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    I have never had an issue with either my Tundra or my RAM 3500 to bring all of the front axle weight/height back to unloaded per the instructions on my Reese Straightline hitch. Even on my 2006 Sierra never had an issue either once I got rid of that POS GM hitch and replaced with a good quality draw-tite hitch that didn't twist all of the place when loading it up. All the weight back to the front axle provides best handling as it brings back the unloaded characteristic of the truck.

    Rob
    Rob & Barb
    2022 Solitude 378MBS
    2022 RAM 3500 SRW HO Aisin 4x4
    Waterloo, Ontario, Canada

  3. #13
    Site Sponsor sande005's Avatar
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    He PM'd me, as I have a similar setup. I replied with many of the same points made here by others.

    Texas Telephone_Man - There is another door sticker that explicitly tells you what your payload capacity is. That's the one people were asking about.
    You'll have to look at the Ford Towing Guide for your truck, to verify whether to go with 25% or 50% of weight minimum restored to the front. My prior advice was for my year (2012). In any event, both with the Andersen "no sway" hitch (which did) and now the ProPride, I have had no issues getting the front down to what it was without the trailer. I detailed how to do it by measuring. Purists will have you go to a scale to get front axle weights unhitched and hitched (with WD set) to determine where you are at. Measuring will get you pretty close, and you can fine tune/verify at a truck scale, if you want.

    Also - can you describe the "bouncing" in more detail? In my PM I talked about true sway, "truck suck", porpoising, and just poor handling. The more detail you can give about it, the better we all may be able to home in on better solutions.

    For others, here's what I PM'd him:

    "I'm not much of a pro at all this, so all I can go one is what I've read before, and a bit of personal experience. So mostly, I can give you what I know about the basics:

    1. Make sure that you have adequate weight on the tongue. This was the huge issue on my older version of the 2670MK. If it is still like you got it from the dealer, then the sheet you got in the pile of papers will list the total real weight. You need at least 12% of that on the ball of the hitch. More is better (12.5 +). Less and you will be prone to sway, which is extremely dangerous. You can go to a truck stop to weigh everything (look up how to do it correctly, lots of descriptions on the 'net), you can buy a special scale from Amazon, or you can even use a bathroom scale and some boards/pipe to do it. Some googling will get more info about any of them. You'll need to recheck after loading for travel, due to more weight and different distribution. If you need more weight up front, maybe storing heavy things way to the front will help, adding a second battery, a tongue mount bike rack, etc. can all be tried. But this spec is critical. (On mine, I just couldn't do it, and ended up buying the ProPride super expensive hitch - it is very heavy in itself, and by design completely prevents any sway.) Note that sway is the moving of the rear end of the trailer back and forth, sometimes very violently. You can see it in the very early stages by one rear corner showing in your side mirror as you drive straight, then moving over to the other side in the other mirror, then back again. You may not feel early hints, but can see it. It gets worse, and felt, at higher speeds. It can surprise you - all seems fine, and then a gust of wind or a bump in the road sets it off. And it can happen very quickly. It's different from "truck suck" where a semi passing wants to pull you into its lane. And not related to front to back "porpoising" where you feel like you are in a fast rocking chair. Or just general "bouncing" and poor control.

    2. Air up your truck tires (and trailer) to the max on the sidewalls. Makes them stiffer, and much less prone to feeling like the truck is bouncing on rubber balls. That will improve things dramatically. But, it will make the ride harsher when driving unhitched - you'll feel all the little bumps in the road.

    3. Check the weight distribution. Unhitched, on a reasonably level surface, put some tape on the front fender over the center of the wheel, and measure the height from the ground to a mark on the tape. Without moving the truck, hook up the trailer, and do NOT set the hitch weight distribution. Remeasure the front, which will now be higher. Now set the weight distribution. Ford says you only need to have the front come back down 1/2 as much as it went up. Adjust the hitch weight distribution as needed to get it there. On my truck, I like it much better by getting it back almost all the way to the original height. But that is dependent on what you find is best for your setup, after some test drives.

    4. Check when fully hitched that the trailer is slightly nose down. The amount is pretty subjective, but some amount helps prevent a "teeter-totter" effect of the trailer trying to pick up the back of the truck a bit when going over bumps. You'll have to get a new mount for the ball, if this is off. The effect is not very different with different amounts, so not something to obsess over. But level or nose up can make things noticeably poorer.

    5. You'll probably find that when loaded for camping and set up as above, your tongue weight will be in the 900+ lb range. If that, plus everything in the truck since it came off the assembly line (including people) is more than the payload sticker allows, then you might assume it is not capable. But if that is good, then the truck is good.

    I've got airbags, but never really use them - they are primarily to correct any significant sag in the rear end of the truck after everything else is set up. I got mine for an old fifth wheel, and found for that they were a minor help. No noticeable difference in the ride quality. If you do install them, you have to recheck weight distribution and trailer nose attitude. Can't say if Sumo Springs work well or not.

    After playing with the above, you still have issues, post a note on the forums for more suggestions...."
    Last edited by sande005; 02-24-2021 at 12:21 PM.
    2017 Imagine 2670MK
    2012 F-150 SCrew, Eco, 4x4 6.5 box
    Max. Tow, HD Payload, Airbags, ProPride hitch
    (Previous: Jayco 26.5RLS Fifth, Revolution Pinbox)

  4. #14
    Left The Driveway Texas Telephone_Man's Avatar
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    So, after loading the 2670, and towing it to the lake several times, here’s where I am. It’s towing much better loaded, but it still feels a little “loose”. By loose I mean, when I exceed 60 MPH, it will sometimes porpoise, and today it tried to sway on me a couple of times. On the way back from the lake today I had the opportunity to swing by a truck stop and get an official weight on the truck only, and the whole rig. Here are the results:

    Truck and trailer combined: Steer axle-2740 lb. Drive axle-3880 lb Trailer axle-7420 lb Total-14040 lb
    Truck only: Steer axle-2960 lb Drive axle-2680 lb Total-5640 lb

    Just for grins, I took the weight distributing bars off and weighed the complete rig again. Here’s that result:
    Truck and trailer combined: Steer axle-2500 lb. Drive axle-4240 lb Trailer axle-7280 lb Total-14020 lb

    Here’s my rig: 2019 Ford F-150 King Ranch with 145” wheel base, 3.5L EcoBoost. WDH-e2 Round Bar with 1000/10,000 lb bars. 2021 Imagine 2670MK. I will also attach pictures of the stickers off of the door.

  5. #15
    Left The Driveway Texas Telephone_Man's Avatar
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  6. #16
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    You need to get more weight distributed

    You lost too much on the steers

    Put some more washers in the hitch or like I have said just get a beefier hitch
    Get a E4 with 1200 lb bars imo and set it up


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  7. #17
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Won’t lie you are getting up there in weight


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  8. #18
    Site Sponsor sande005's Avatar
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    From the above, trailer is at 8,400. Tongue weight is 980 or 11.6%. Not near enough tongue weight. Should be above 1060 at that weight.

    (3880+2740) truck with trailer, - 5640 truck only, means 980 tongue.

    BUT - your trailer is only 95 lbs away from max. Your truck max is 6750, and actual is 5640, so you've only got 1110 for the trailer tongue plus anything not in the truck when you went over the scale (wife, dog, etc.)

    Time to put the trailer on a diet, and move heavy stuff way to the front to get the relative tongue weight above 12.5%, minimum. If you had full water, that would explain getting close to the max weight. But running empty tanks will make the tongue weight problem worse.

    For porpoising/handling, get more weight on the steer. You've restored a bit more than 50% of what was lost, but many of us find getting back to full weight helps a lot.
    Fill all your tires to the max on the sidewalls when towing.


    Hate to say it, but those were almost exactly the same numbers I fought with mine. In the end, the expensive (and heavy) ProPrde was the solution. But I've got the HD Payload option, so lots of payload to spare.....
    I would have hoped GD had redesigned in the last 4 years to move the axels back a few inches to resolve this without that resort. But apparently not.
    Last edited by sande005; 03-12-2021 at 09:57 PM.
    2017 Imagine 2670MK
    2012 F-150 SCrew, Eco, 4x4 6.5 box
    Max. Tow, HD Payload, Airbags, ProPride hitch
    (Previous: Jayco 26.5RLS Fifth, Revolution Pinbox)

  9. #19
    Left The Driveway Texas Telephone_Man's Avatar
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    Thanks for the reply. I had come to the same conclusion, that I needed to upgrade my WDH, if I was going to keep the King Ranch. I have a few questions about your reply.

    1. I had the trailer weight at 7420, which is what it said on the scale. Do you get 8400 by adding the 7420 plus the tongue weight of 980?
    2. You said that I needed to get more weight on the steer, that I had restored a bit more than 50% of what I had lost. Can you explain that?
    3. It seems to me that I am pushing the limits of what this truck can handle. Even if I spend $$$$ for the ProPride and get the weight distribution correct, and smooth out the handling, will this truck always struggle, especially if I'm towing the trailer through the mountains of Tennessee and Virginia, which I plan to do in September?

    Final conclusion: I'm not as smart as I thought. I thought because the King Ranch's towing capacity was much greater than the maximum trailer weight, that I should be good. There's a lot more than that that goes into safe towing.

  10. #20
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Texas Telephone_Man View Post
    Thanks for the reply. I had come to the same conclusion, that I needed to upgrade my WDH, if I was going to keep the King Ranch. I have a few questions about your reply.

    1. I had the trailer weight at 7420, which is what it said on the scale. Do you get 8400 by adding the 7420 plus the tongue weight of 980?
    2. You said that I needed to get more weight on the steer, that I had restored a bit more than 50% of what I had lost. Can you explain that?
    3. It seems to me that I am pushing the limits of what this truck can handle. Even if I spend $$$$ for the ProPride and get the weight distribution correct, and smooth out the handling, will this truck always struggle, especially if I'm towing the trailer through the mountains of Tennessee and Virginia, which I plan to do in September?

    Final conclusion: I'm not as smart as I thought. I thought because the King Ranch's towing capacity was much greater than the maximum trailer weight, that I should be good. There's a lot more than that that goes into safe towing.
    You need to tilt the head of the hitch down more to put more force on the bars
    Unsure with your hitch how to adjust but that in the poi’s what is needed
    Doing this will force more weight to the front
    You don’t want to lose any weight on the front
    This needs to be fixed
    Question is is your hitch strong enough to do that

    The problem with trucks and payload is that all the nice options kill payload
    My truck has power windows and cruise and such but pretty base other than that
    A king ranch likely has the worst payload of any truck due to options

    You may always struggle with this combo

    I think rear kitchen trailers are inherently poor towers due to weight distribution


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

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