The end of DRW?

[CaptPicardo]

I respect this group and realize this may be a controversial thread, but have to say - are we seeing the end of DRW?

Here's why I ask - the 2020 manufactures have upped their game and I'm seeing so many SRW Ford, Ram and GM vehicles with enhanced springs and load enhancements that I'm not sure whether DRWs are really needed any further for a 5er at 18k or less weight.

I'm going to say that's a thing of the past and I look forward to your candid feedback.

Best,
Jeff

[geotex1]

There are two aspects you are never going to replace the advantage of a dually over a single rear wheel - stability and the advantage in the event of a blowout on that loaded rear. To me personally, these considerations are tangible when I consider the load, the length, our travel range, our travel style, how we value the investment, and so on. Another way to say it, perhaps, is that I see capability as more than capacity. I want our tow vehicle to do the job, and do the job well.

No doubt this will be an interesting thread to come.

[FT4NOW]

You can increase the limits of the truck all day long, but at that point you will still be limited by the tire itself. Obviously a single tire wont be able to compare to a dual tire setup when looking at weight ratings. I dont think its end of the DRW, there is still the F450 in the less than 14k class of trucks, and the bigger DRWs that would require different licensing unless you register them as 14k trucks. I think DRWs are great for towing, definitely makes for a very stable tow, especially in the wind. I know I'll get another DRW at some point, most likely when we dont live in Idaho anymore, the snow here is the only reason I sold mine.

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[xrated]

I respect this group and realize this may be a controversial thread, but have to say - are we seeing the end of DRW?

Here's why I ask - the 2020 manufactures have upped their game and I'm seeing so many SRW Ford, Ram and GM vehicles with enhanced springs and load enhancements that I'm not sure whether DRWs are really needed any further for a 5er at 18k or less weight.

I'm going to say that's a thing of the past and I look forward to your candid feedback.

Best,
Jeff

Let's look at an 18K GVWR 5ver and the amount of pin weight that it will put down....plus the other things that factor into it. So at a minimum, you are going to see at least 3600 lbs or so of pin weight. However, many times, the pin weight will be more than the "average" calculated 20% of the trailer weight. So let's use 22% instead and then you will be looking at 3960 lbs of pin weight. Now let's add up the rest of the numbers....weight of the 5ver hitch...~175 to maybe 200 lbs, how about passengers in the truck....200 lb....300 lbs...??? lbs. Then there is the possibility of a toolbox in the bed of the truck with who know what in it...maybe another 200 lbs. What about extra fuel being carried or an aux. tank added to the bed of the truck? Firewood...maybe. The list of other "stuff" is of course dependent on each individual, but the example I just stated would add 600 to 700 lbs or more, on top of the 3960 lbs of a 22% pin weight calculation. Now you are right back to a Dually configuration needed in what started off as "just an 18K" trailer. Just some food for thought.

And I do realize, as you stated, the 2020 models and up have increased the GVWR and thus the payload numbers, and that certainly helps to be able to use a SRW instead of a DRW in some instances, but the bottom line is that you still have to know (or be very close to) what your total weight is that will be burdened on the truck...and what it's limitations are in GVWR, GCVWR, RAWR, FAWR, Payload, etc, etc.

[orbsah]

To keep an open mind on this. . . . DRW is a “solution” to some specific “requirements”. Requirements referring to payload, stability, cost, reliability, etc. Now “IF” a truck manufacturer can meet or exceed these requirements w/ a redesigned SRW vehicle, I suspect most of us would be all over it. Although I don’t follow what manufacturer’s are developing, who knows what’s in store for us in 3-5 years?

Although not likely comparable, I've seen some semi-tractors that sport single rear wheels where there have traditionally been two. . . .

[Canyonlight]

To keep an open mind on this. . . . DRW is a “solution” to some specific “requirements”. Requirements referring to payload, stability, cost, reliability, etc. Now “IF” a truck manufacturer can meet or exceed these requirements w/ a redesigned SRW vehicle, I suspect most of us would be all over it. Although I don’t follow what manufacturer’s are developing, who knows what’s in store for us in 3-5 years?

Although not likely comparable, I've seen some semi-tractors that sport single rear wheels where there have traditionally been two. . . .

Yes, I am not familiar with the loads and ratings of these large (very wide) single tires on semi tractors and trailers but we have been seeing them all over our part of the country for a few years and growing in numbers. It would be interesting to learn of these equipped semi rings have the same load carrying capacities.

I suspect carriers are using these to lower costs as the main reason but it would be interesting to learn more from our semi tractor friends on the forum as to upsides/downsides.

Jeff @CaptPicardo - Now this said, will this very wide single semi rig tire scenario be part of the HD pickup scene or not. It would be interesting to learn more about this too if we have some folks with factual knowledge. Good thread to learn more going forward. Thanks, for starting it.

Dan

[bertschb]

I respect this group and realize this may be a controversial thread, but have to say - are we seeing the end of DRW?

Not a chance. Until manufacturers can produce an SRW truck with 5,000lbs of payload, we will always have DRW trucks. And that's not taking into consideration the extra stability and redundancy that the extra rear tires provide.

The increased payload we're seeing in new HD trucks is allowing folks to haul heavier 5th wheels than they could in the past but there are still plenty of 5th wheels out there (particularly toy haulers) that far exceed the payload rating of any SRW truck.

[geotex1]

To keep an open mind on this. . . . DRW is a “solution” to some specific “requirements”. Requirements referring to payload, stability, cost, reliability, etc. Now “IF” a truck manufacturer can meet or exceed these requirements w/ a redesigned SRW vehicle, I suspect most of us would be all over it. Although I don’t follow what manufacturer’s are developing, who knows what’s in store for us in 3-5 years?

Although not likely comparable, I've seen some semi-tractors that sport single rear wheels where there have traditionally been two. . . .

Super Singles suffer EXACTLY the same issues we are talking about with 1-ton SRW versus DRW. They are more fuel efficient, less rotating mass, but also less stable and the driver is more apt to lose control in the event of a blowout under load. I think some of you know that the company I work for also has its own trucking company. Our manufactured projects are heavy, and our loading is done with every truck scaled because of it. Due to some possible credits and the corporate MBAs crunching projected cost savings related to improved fuel mileage (nevermind the cost consideration of a Super Single versus conventional dually tire), 10 trucks fitted with Super Singles were added to the fleet when conventional 10-wheel tractors were retired out. Guess what trucks are costing us the most money now 5 years in terms of O&M, product loss, and insurance claims? Just to add, the decision-makers were marauders - in and out of the company in 3 years making nothing but the worst decsions...

[xrated]

Not a chance. Until manufacturers can produce an SRW truck with 5,000lbs of payload, we will always have DRW trucks. And that's not taking into consideration the extra stability and redundancy that the extra rear tires provide.

The increased payload we're seeing in new HD trucks is allowing folks to haul heavier 5th wheels than they could in the past but there are still plenty of 5th wheels out there (particularly toy haulers) that far exceed the payload rating of any SRW truck.

You mean like this one.....

[bertschb]

You mean like this one.....

Yep! That's what I had in mind.