User Tag List

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 30
  1. #1
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    16
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    My first experience with a fifth wheel

    In January 2020 we purchased a new 2020 Grand Design Reflection 150 Series 230RL Fifth Wheel RV from Lazydays, 6130 Lazydays Boulevard, Seffner, FL 33584. Before we took delivery, I was told that the cost of replacing the Westlake wheels/tires with ones that I would provide leaving the removed ones behind. The $500 quote for labor was unacceptable. More on this later. We took the RV to Ft. DeSoto Park for one night and discovered that the mattress platform width was 54 inches, 6 inches short of the 60 by 80 queen size mattress as specified in the documents. The lack of support under the edges of the mattress made it impossible to get sufficient rest for the following day. Then I discovered that the battery was losing charge because the battery disconnect switch did not disconnect the entire load from the battery. The manual instructions state that the battery cable needs to be disconnected to prevent battery drain. I installed a second battery disconnect switch in series with the battery cable. A plastic plug in the steps was damaged and a speaker grill was missing which were not available for replacement. After many months had passed because of Covid and vaccination time frames, I contacted Lazydays to see if the $10,000 free camping offered with the purchase of the RV could be extended. The answer was no. In April, we planned our first real trip to Osage Beach on Lake of the Ozarks. On the way back, along I-10, the right rear tire blew which sounded like bomb went off inside the RV from within the tow vehicle. The flying rubber from the tire stripped the fender skirt from the RV and damaged the steps. The shockwave created by the blowout damaged the television mounting bracket and completely shattered two shower door panels leaving small shards of glass in the shower base, and on the bathroom and hallway floors. I found a tire store to replace the tires with 14-ply steel belted trailer tires. Westlake tires are in the top seven of the worst tires sold. After arriving home, I drove to Lazydays to find out what options I had for repairs. At this point, the RV was out of warranty and the hourly rate for Lazydays service was greater than $150. I asked to see someone in service. Not possible. I was told to see a scheduler first. Two women were sitting in adjacent offices looking busy. I stood there for ten minutes before I was invited to take a seat. I was denied the opportunity to talk with someone in service, second attempt. She did schedule a service appointment date six weeks out to talk to someone to find out what I already knew. The parts would be ordered which would further extend the time to effect repairs. My wife contacted the companies which supplied the parts I needed. Everything showed up within ten days and I installed everything in short order. I contacted Lazydays and cancelled my appointment. One of the reasons I purchased an RV from Grand Design was the claim of a third party (or a separate independent department) for quality control which did not meet my expectations. Neither did Customer Care at Lazydays. Do others have similar experiences or is this the territory of RVing?
    Last edited by RichInFla; 08-04-2021 at 09:20 PM.

  2. #2
    Site Sponsor livinthelife's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2016
    Location
    SoCal
    Posts
    2,807
    Mentioned
    26 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by RichInFla View Post
    In January 2020 we purchased a new 2020 Grand Design Reflection 150 Series 230RL Fifth Wheel RV from Lazydays, 6130 Lazydays Boulevard, Seffner, FL 33584. Before we took delivery, I was told that the cost of replacing the Westlake wheels/tires with ones that I would provide leaving the removed ones behind. The $500 quote for labor was unacceptable. More on this later. We took the RV to Ft. DeSoto Park for one night and discovered that the mattress platform width was 54 inches, 6 inches short of the 60 by 80 queen size mattress as specified in the documents. The lack of support under the edges of the mattress made it impossible to get sufficient rest for the following day. Then I discovered that the battery was losing charge because the battery disconnect switch did not disconnect the entire load from the battery. The manual instructions state that the battery cable needs to be disconnected to prevent battery drain. I installed a second battery disconnect switch in series with the battery cable. A plastic plug in the steps was damaged and a speaker grill was missing which were not available for replacement. After many months had passed because of Covid and vaccination time frames, I contacted Lazydays to see if the $10,000 free camping offered with the purchase of the RV could be extended. The answer was no. In April, we planned our first real trip to Osage Beach on Lake of the Ozarks. On the way back, along I-10, the right rear tire blew which sounded like bomb went off inside the RV from within the tow vehicle. The flying rubber from the tire stripped the fender skirt from the RV and damaged the steps. The shockwave created by the blowout damaged the television mounting bracket and completely shattered two shower door panels leaving small shards of glass in the shower base, and on the bathroom and hallway floors. I found a tire store to replace the tires with 14-ply steel belted trailer tires. Westlake tires are in the top seven of the worst tires sold. After arriving home, I drove to Lazydays to find out what options I had for repairs. At this point, the RV was out of warranty and the hourly rate for Lazydays service was greater than $150. I asked to see someone in service. Not possible. I was told to see a scheduler first. Two women were sitting in adjacent offices looking busy. I stood there for ten minutes before I was invited to take a seat. I was denied the opportunity to talk with someone in service, second attempt. She did schedule a service appointment date six weeks out to talk to someone to find out what I already knew. The parts would be ordered which would further extend the time to effect repairs. My wife contacted the companies which supplied the parts I needed. Everything showed up within ten days and I installed everything in short order. I contacted Lazydays and cancelled my appointment. One of the reasons I purchased an RV from Grand Design was the claim of a third party (or a separate independent department) for quality control which did not meet my expectations. Neither did Customer Care at Lazydays. Do others have similar experiences or is this the territory of RVing?
    Generally, service departments at dealerships are not considered the best option. Did you contact GD directly with any of your issues? Often, if you do, and you tell them that the dealership isn't playing nice, they will authorize an independent repair facility to do warranty work.

    Also, for the most part, GD rigs are not necessarily any "better" than any other manufacturer's rigs, but the after sales customer service is where they do better than others.

    2017 Reflection 26RL "Mili"
    2016 Ford F250 Extended Cab Gas Engine "Buck" (the truck)

  3. #3
    Fireside Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2019
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    48
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Sorry to hear of your experieces...I can relate as I have had a somewhat simular situation with my 2020 Reflection 295RL (150 series) Many minor issues that needed to be fixed under warranty were done, however 2 nneded more attention - Fireplace ceased to work - needed replacing, & the furnace heat had peeled the bedroom pocket door (despite GD claiming in advertizing that there are no heat vents in the floor) = reqiuring a new door. Both were ordered and I was given a date 10 weeks away for theses to be fitted.

    Fustratingly I waited for my warranty repair date. Near the date, I called my dealer to see if the parts had arrived. They stated that the door had arrived, but they were still waiting for the fireplace. I took the initiative and called Grand Design myself and was told that the fireplace had been discontinued, I asked what happened to the Purchase order to which they said that it had "dropped off" I asked what was replacing the discontinued fireplace- the reply was " I dont know", I called 2 days later and insisted that they find the replacement fireplace and send it to the dealer. Now more waiting for the dealer to fit 2 parts that would take at most 1 hour to fit.

    Fitting day ---- took the dealer 2 days,

    I have gotten the feeling that at this dealer no-one gives a damn about the customer. Proved-by not following up on the order All they want to do is sell, sell, sell. Their customer service is non existant. Unfortunatly the next dealer is 4 hours away.

    Luckily I had replaced my Westlakes "time bombs" with Goodyear Endurance before our major trip to Yellowstone - I had heard about the damage a blow out could cause

    So in ending, your "horror story" although nasty is not unusual.for dealers or GD

  4. #4
    Seasoned Camper Skilletface's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2020
    Location
    Nicholson, Ga.
    Posts
    127
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    RichInFla, It’s to bad you are having to go through this process. If you feel none of your issues are of your doing, stay on Grand Design until you reach a resolution. Dealers are only store fronts selling a manufactured item not of their building. The RV industry is not like a big box retailer where you just return for any reason and or go back to the shelf and get another one.

    Please forgive I do have to ask, was there not a PDI preformed with you on delivery? From your explanation of events it looks as there was a great deal of time elapsed, during COVID, before discovering some of your issues and the time frame for utilizing any perks tolled before you could take advantage of them.

    Your tire issue is a Grand Design upgrade option and if the dealer was willing to change them out for most likely Goodyear Endurance, 500$ was not to bad of a deal when compared to the bottom line installation of any tire sales location.

    Grand Designs CS is better than most TT manufacturers and that is who you should be working with and don’t muddy the water by running back and fourth between GD and the dealer. Anyone will tell you now is not the time to set a high expectation for getting anything repaired as you will be disappointed.


    I have posted about the transporters being abusive during transportation of these new units from the manufacturer. That stated I could not place all QC issues at the feet of manufactures.

    Manufacturers build it, QC releases it, Transporters drag them at higher speeds than designed in and out of construction zones, dealers receive them with out a PDI before receiving from the Transporter, Customer accepts delivery and in the excitement of your new rig things don’t get discovered until the madden voyage.

    This is an all true reoccurring event
    Last edited by Skilletface; 08-05-2021 at 09:02 AM. Reason: Adding commentary:
    2017 F-250 6.7 2019 273 MK
    Retired Tanker Yanker
    My your pleasures be many and your troubles be few!

  5. #5
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Woodstock
    Posts
    3,634
    Mentioned
    60 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    My first experience with a fifth wheel

    Welcome to the forum


    I guess I don’t understand where you feel the quality control was bad

    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    Last edited by NB Canada; 08-05-2021 at 04:29 AM.
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  6. #6
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    16
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by livinthelife View Post
    Generally, service departments at dealerships are not considered the best option. Did you contact GD directly with any of your issues? Often, if you do, and you tell them that the dealership isn't playing nice, they will authorize an independent repair facility to do warranty work.

    Also, for the most part, GD rigs are not necessarily any "better" than any other manufacturer's rigs, but the after sales customer service is where they do better than others.
    “Better than others” doesn’t say much considering what others have reported about the RVs they have purchased. Glowing reviews on GD website from people who have owned their GD RV for a few months. Six months after my GD was manufactured, GD was not stocking parts that I needed for repair. Furthermore, GD had no idea as to where I could obtain them except for contacting the original manufacturer of the parts installed in the RV. After I took delivery of the RV, I received a stack of warranty forms for all the equipment installed in the RV. Too many red flags which seems standard for all RV manufacturers. My wife and I started out with tents followed by two van conversions, a Jayco towable, cabins, house rentals and, finally the GD fifth wheel RV. Perhaps the drop in quality may be attributed to Winnebago which purchased GD. Winnebago is also known for a high rate of customer complaints. It was never in my intention to have the GD serviced out of warranty at Lazydays. My intention was to verify my treatment with the experience of two friends who had work done at Lazydays which was not good. I found the damaged plug replacement at Lowes. The manufacturer of the shower door was found on a sticker holding a few shards of glass together. I ordered the fender skirt from Lazydays. I received it in a few days in a flimsy cardboard box and the skirt was cracked. It was reported and replaced albeit in a similar carton. As for the tires, I could kick myself for not doing that at the outset. I found better tires which my car dealership would have installed with tire pressure sensors for $80. The total cost for the repairs, sans tires, was less than $200 and the installations were straight forward. I would not even guess what Lazydays would have charged me nor how long it would have taken.

  7. #7
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Location
    Woodstock
    Posts
    3,634
    Mentioned
    60 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by RichInFla;
    After I took delivery of the RV, I received a stack of warranty forms for all the equipment installed in the RV. Too many red flags which seems standard for all RV.
    This has always been like this
    I had a large packet with my last Jayco as well
    Unsure how this is a red flag

    Quite frankly the only issue I see is the tire damage which could be entirely your fault. Not saying it is but it could be
    I have many thousands of KMs on mine and they are perfect as the very large majority do as well

    Are you not all up and running now and good to go?


    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 crew
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  8. #8
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    16
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Yep. And I knew about the Westlakes but I talked myself out of replacing them because they were new with no miles on them, and I believed the propaganda of GD being the best of the rest. I also replaced the battery because the power disconnect switch of the GD did not disconnect everything from the battery (solved). The internal resistance of the battery had increased to unacceptable limits and was discarded. I replaced it with a LiFePO4 battery which has internal circuits to protect it from the tow vehicle's charging profile which is not in compliance with a Lithium battery charging profile. After our one and only trip, we decided to dump the RV. Now, it has been several months since that first trip (a cooling off period) and we decided to make another attempt. Still, I think the GD days are over. Yes, I am good to go.
    Last edited by RichInFla; 08-05-2021 at 11:19 AM.

  9. #9
    Site Team traveldawg's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2017
    Location
    Florida Space Coast
    Posts
    3,843
    Blog Entries
    1
    Mentioned
    94 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    RichInFl,
    Sorry for you troubles. You're not alone. Not that that is any consolation. But all RVs are notorious for build quality, just about everyone has a bad story about dealer service, and I don't think any manufacture is much better than another these days.

    It use to be different, but times have changed. And especially in these boom-times for RV manufactures I think the overall experience has suffered - long waits everywhere for built & delivery & service, parts shortages, etc.

    If it's any advice at all it is that you just sort of come to expect it. It's not the best advice, but you just have to sort of roll with it. Lesser folks will give it up soon when they figure out it might not be all they expected.

    Enjoy you time with the rig. We'll "see" ya at the Tampa RV show this January..

    oh - we bought our rig at LD in Seffner at the 2018 Tampa show. Having had a bunch of RVs previously and having shopped around in the 2nd half of 2017 we knew what we wanted. LD ended up with the best offer. We took delivery but never went back for service. EVERYONE complains about the waits for service there - even the "big boys" - even when they get the "Crown Club" treatment.....
    Larry KE4DMG
    2022 F-350 KRU SRW LB - Airlift 5000+, ForScan, 37 RDS Aux Tank,
    2019 310GK-R - Sailuns; MorRyde IS; Disc Brakes; 20K Reese Goosebox
    Search kalakamods for my mods


  10. #10
    Setting Up Camp
    Join Date
    Aug 2019
    Posts
    16
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Right, it is my fault. Driving on the roads from Florida to the Lake of the Ozarks are the worst roads that I have ever traveled on. Westlakes are not designed to travel over a bump in the road. My tow vehicle is a 2020 Chevrolet 2500HD High Country which made the trip without a problem. And it could do just as well on rough terrain. I have driven more than a million miles on cars, pickups, and motorcycles. Every dealership has spare parts for repairs. I do not have to contact anyone else to get them repaired. As I recall, locating the replacement for the damaged plug was a dead end. I lucked out when I found one at Lowes.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

DISCLAIMER:This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by Grand Design RV, LLC or any of its affiliates. This is an independent site.