GD Quality ??? Not in my book

[Hoopy Frood]

So people should just stop buying RV's? For how long? 3 years? 5 years? Longer? Realistic options should also be listed. Otherwise it's just more whinging.

[trailrydr]

So people should just stop buying RV's? For how long? 3 years? 5 years? Longer? Realistic options should also be listed. Otherwise it's just more whinging.

I agree...

Would also add.... poor manufacturing practices and higher pricing dont seem to blend well together in any time period, IMO.

[Justa5th]

Figured it wouldn’t take long for the “well that’s the way it is” crowd to show up. If you look at any other large purchase by any product manufacturer that let quality control slide it was usually corrected by the oh mighty dollar. Obviously automobiles top the list. If your product quality sucks either you fix it or someone else comes along who does it better. At that point you again either fix it or you go out of business. As mentioned earlier that’s what happen to US auto manufacturers.
The biggest issue now is there is very little competition in the rv industry. When a company that comes along and does it better it gets bought out and quality reverts to what the new and bigger company wants. There is absolutely ZERO incentive for any company to change the way they do business if it is gaining them record profits.
How to fix it?
1. Stop buying low quality rv’s and paying a premium for them. I guarantee it will correct itself quickly. Remember the lack of competition? That means there’s only a couple company wallets that need to get hit.
2. Stop rolling over and not fighting rv manufacturers that put out poor quality products. I’m not a huge fan of attorneys being the first response to problems, but I truly believe they play and important role. If a product you buy sucks and the manufacturer tells you to pound sand then attorney up and cost them money.
3. The rv industry as a whole needs better protection at the state levels for lemon laws. If you have ever had a problem with a automobile you will realize how nervous the dealers are when they are approaching the 3 repair attempts or 30 days. Again…it hits them in the wallet.

I guarantee most people wouldn’t go look at x brand vehicle if the last 2 x brand vehicles were junk. If your $100,000 pickup left you sitting on the side of the road I’d bet you would consider a different brand or type.

I will add the consumers are the one that train companies what we want and except. We ask for 80” big screens for $500 and the company will build you one but it’s going to be missing something. Eventually competition catches up and $500 tvs have features and quality. We as consumers have told rv manufacturers that we want bling and a low price. That’s what you got…bling, low prices and low quality.

And for anyone that wants to question if I’m doing my part I’ll leave you with this. I have owned 8 rv’s in my life. A major part of my retirement plan (currently retired) was to travel the country in an rv. I no longer own one…

[Hoopy Frood]

It certainly sounds good the way you phrase it, but I really think you have it backwards: the companies manufacture a product, and then creates a market. Did you ever really feel life wouldn't be complete without having a pocket phone, or one you could wear on your wrist, or heated steering wheels, or all wheel drive vehicles? Dodge, Chevy, Ford, and GMC all used fuel injection pumps on their diesel trucks that fail at a higher than normal rate. Has public outcry over this resulted in any action, other than what Ram has done? Chevy/GMC made pickup trucks that consistently rusted out, and they did this for decades. Guess they didn't care about consumer satisfaction even after all that time. So excuse me if I don't feel the RV industry is going to straighten their act up if a few years go by with lower than usual sales. You bought an RV, for all I know, you've bought more than one, so even you didn't choose to heed your own advice. Sorry, but my list of things I want to do doesn't include waiting who knows how long, so I can go traveling.

As far as I can tell, New Coke is about the only thing I can think of that public opinion actually caused it's demise. Oh, and maybe the Edsel. Besides, I really like my Grand Design.

[goducks14]

Most people need autos and phones. Thats the way life works today.
Most people don't NEED RV's. They want RV's
Most people have short memories.
Too many people are looking for some kind of gratification in life.
RV's satisfy that want.

Couple all that in a hyped out RV thats blinged out to the gills with eye candy, now add tv commercials showing some family of four setup by a nice river or lake and there's the reason people won't stop buying RV's even knowing that there's a good chance it could be a POS.

The RV industry is playing to RV buyers weaknesses.

[Justa5th]

It certainly sounds good the way you phrase it, but I really think you have it backwards: the companies manufacture a product, and then creates a market. Did you ever really feel life wouldn't be complete without having a pocket phone, or one you could wear on your wrist, or heated steering wheels, or all wheel drive vehicles? Dodge, Chevy, Ford, and GMC all used fuel injection pumps on their diesel trucks that fail at a higher than normal rate. Has public outcry over this resulted in any action, other than what Ram has done? Chevy/GMC made pickup trucks that consistently rusted out, and they did this for decades. Guess they didn't care about consumer satisfaction even after all that time. So excuse me if I don't feel the RV industry is going to straighten their act up if a few years go by with lower than usual sales. You bought an RV, for all I know, you've bought more than one, so even you didn't choose to heed your own advice. Sorry, but my list of things I want to do doesn't include waiting who knows how long, so I can go traveling.

As far as I can tell, New Coke is about the only thing I can think of that public opinion actually caused it's demise. Oh, and maybe the Edsel. Besides, I really like my Grand Design.

I can agree with some of your points but not all. Did Ram replace 2 years worth of CP4 pumps out of the goodness of their hearts? More likely it was because of public outcry and the public reporting problems to the NHTSA. Again if people continue to buy a product the way it is manufactured and it makes the company money there is no incentive for said company to change. Although not realistic if Ram didn’t sell one truck next year do you think there would be some discussions about what went wrong and how to fix it? Business are in business to make a profit for themselves and their shareholders…end of story. When the RV market imploded around 2009/2010 stuff changed. Prices came down significantly and quality somewhat increased (probably due to slower building). All manufacturers are in control again but it will be cyclical.

As far as following my own advice read my post. I changed my retirement plans. I have owned 8 rvs and watched quality decline. I no longer own one. I’m not happy about it but there’s always other stuff to do. I speak with my wallet wether it be at restaurants, vehicles etc. I’m in the minority therefore until a majority (not all) speak up and vote with their dollars things will stay the same.

[trailrydr]

Most people need autos and phones. Thats the way life works today.
Most people don't NEED RV's. They want RV's
Most people have short memories.
Too many people are looking for some kind of gratification in life.
RV's satisfy that want.

Couple all think in a hyped out RV thats blinged out to the gills with eye candy, now add tv commercials showing some family of four setup by a nice river or lake and there's the reason people won't stop buying RV's even knowing that there's a good chance it could be a POS.

The RV industry is playing to RV buyers weaknesses.

Satisifying until the bill comes in and the only RV experience they have had so far is to leave it at the dealership for a month (or longer) after signing the papers....



Wife and I say the same thing about dining out. Poor service, cold food, and people lined up around the block to eat there. Its a wonder isn't it?

[Hoopy Frood]

I have no idea whether Ram is doing it out of the goodness of their hear, very doubtful, but if companies were concerned with consumer outrage, Chevy, GM, and Ford would be doing the same as Ram. And so far, they ain't.

I love how people think "Oh if only the Japanese started making RV's, the American companies would get their act together". There's a good example of short term memory loss. The American car companies still made crap cars after the Japanese cars came to these shores. Chevy Cavalier, Chevy Vega, Dodge K-cars, Ford Pinto, ad nauseum. I mean, Yugo's sold in the US for 7 years. SEVEN YEARS selling a car that was an undeniable POS, in fact I think if you look up POS in the dictionary, the Yugo is there. They sold very few cars after the first few years, but they still tried to sell them. So there's no indication that low sales really makes much impact, in a lot of instances.

At least the RV industry doesn't have the motto the boating industry has: "The two best days in my life were the day I bought my boat, and the day I sold my boat".

[Hoopy Frood]

"Wife and I say the same thing about dining out. Poor service, cold food, and people lined up around the block to eat there. Its a wonder isn't it?"

Marketing, pure and simple. Why do you think places like Applebees, Red Lobster, Olive Garden, Cheesecake Factory, Cracker Barrel, et. al., still exist serving mediocre food?

[goducks14]

I have no idea whether Ram is doing it out of the goodness of their hear, very doubtful, but if companies were concerned with consumer outrage, Chevy, GM, and Ford would be doing the same as Ram. And so far, they ain't.

I love how people think "Oh if only the Japanese started making RV's, the American companies would get their act together". There's a good example of short term memory loss. The American car companies still made crap cars after the Japanese cars came to these shores. Chevy Cavalier, Chevy Vega, Dodge K-cars, Ford Pinto, ad nauseum. I mean, Yugo's sold in the US for 7 years. SEVEN YEARS selling a car that was an undeniable POS, in fact I think if you look up POS in the dictionary, the Yugo is there. They sold very few cars after the first few years, but they still tried to sell them. So there's no indication that low sales really makes much impact, in a lot of instances.

At least the RV industry doesn't have the motto the boating industry has: "The two best days in my life were the day I bought my boat, and the day I sold my boat".

I think you could still hang the term "Money Pit" on either though.