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  1. #11
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grizz80 View Post
    so are you saying you deploy the slide prior to autolevel or after?
    I don’t have auto level on my Imagine but I deploy my slide after I level the trailer with the wheels then I lower my stabilizers. Never before

    Camping this season a guy pulled in to the site beside me with a Kodiak smaller than my GD and he had auto level. Imo the auto level was really twisting that trailer. I couldn’t believe it
    Just a theory like I said but jacks can really flex a frame to a point doors don’t work well so why couldn’t it affect a slide
    They are built and tested on their wheels not on jacks
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
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  2. #12
    Big Traveler dryfly's Avatar
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    Since we see so many issues with the Schwintek slides I'd sure like to know if the leveling process is responsible. On trailers without the auto-leveling system, the stabilizers are designed to stabilize, not level. There should not be enough pressure exerted by them to twist the frame, so not an issue if used correctly. But, are they incorrectly being used for leveling purposes.

    On the other hand, I think there are folks that think nothing about using the auto-levelers to lift tires off the ground if that's what it takes to level. Maybe that's what's causing the slide issues.

    Personally, nothing impresses me about the Schwintek system. It's got possibilities but there is too many moving parts.
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  3. #13
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dryfly View Post
    Since we see so many issues with the Schwintek slides I'd sure like to know if the leveling process is responsible. On trailers without the auto-leveling system, the stabilizers are designed to stabilize, not level. There should not be enough pressure exerted by them to twist the frame, so not an issue if used correctly. But, are they incorrectly being used for leveling purposes.

    On the other hand, I think there are folks that think nothing about using the auto-levelers to lift tires off the ground if that's what it takes to level. Maybe that's what's causing the slide issues.

    Personally, nothing impresses me about the Schwintek system. It's got possibilities but there is too many moving parts.
    During my camping season this year alone I likely witnessed at a minimum 50 people arrive at a nearby site
    It is almost a guarantee that out of that 50 ,46-47 brought out the infamous impact gun to deploy their stabilizers. Lol. It even says right on them not to so it is confusing how this silly trend started I think they like the noise
    One I took notice of in particular with an Imagine 2910
    He struggled for almost 30 minutes backing this behemoth in. Once he got to the stabilizers I could here him just pounding on them with the impact gun
    Then he would go look at a level on the A frame. He was leveling the coach with the stabs
    I personally think this is one of the main causes of failure
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
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  4. #14
    Paid my dues 😁 FT4NOW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NB Canada View Post
    During my camping season this year alone I likely witnessed at a minimum 50 people arrive at a nearby site
    It is almost a guarantee that out of that 50 ,46-47 brought out the infamous impact gun to deploy their stabilizers. Lol. It even says right on them not to so it is confusing how this silly trend started I think they like the noise
    One I took notice of in particular with an Imagine 2910
    He struggled for almost 30 minutes backing this behemoth in. Once he got to the stabilizers I could here him just pounding on them with the impact gun
    Then he would go look at a level on the A frame. He was leveling the coach with the stabs
    I personally think this is one of the main causes of failure
    I think a lot of people misunderstand that they are stabilizer jacks, not leveling jacks. I would venture to say most of it is lack of knowledge.
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  5. #15
    Site Team Redapple63's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FT4NOW View Post
    I think a lot of people misunderstand that they are stabilizer jacks, not leveling jacks. I would venture to say most of it is lack of knowledge.
    Agree with this. I have the Lippert Electric Stabilizers. I always level side to side with my plastic blocks first, then front to back with the hitch jack. Them and only them do in put down the stabilizers, and even then once the touch on both sides, just a quick second more is it.

    I think it may be easier to over stress with the stab jacks because once they land the impact can keep them going until they break out twist something. The electrics really don’t have too much oomph to go much more.

    Bill
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  6. #16
    Long Hauler geotex1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NB Canada View Post
    They were installed and tested at the factory just on the wheels not with jacks down
    The frames can easily be flexed with jacks and I don’t want it to bind the slide
    The only schwintek slide you have would not be affected by the leveling jacks as it is in the bedroom
    NB,

    I understand what you are attempting to drive at, but your understanding has a base flaw. The factory floor is level. All trailers on the line, 5er or TT, are sitting on their front jack(s) or on stands. All of them. So they're firmly planted on their wheels but have 3 or 4 points of support and are level. Yes, I have been to all of the major manufacturers' lines as well as the semi-custom and full-custom builders. The factory does not install or operate the slide with the frame in any sort of torsion, which is what you will encounter the majority of the time. Further, especially with through frame mechanisms, the operation relies on gravity to help stand the box - there's no mechanical control at the top on these. For the deeper and longer boxes, being out of level and/or twisted is very hard on the rather primitive system.

    A lot of dealers give bad advise that the buyer will be fine... Believing anything an RV dealer says is just gambling. Plenty of misunderstanding on the internet forums too. Neither will pay for the repairs should they be needed. Will weekend warriors' odds be in their favor and not have an issue not being level and repeated doing this? Could be. Those of use who camp longer and move more frequently, not so much. More like a matter of time.

    The mass produced frames and mechanisms, as best stated, are designed but not engineered. The "design" also involves immense trial and error, and unfortunately the retail customer is also the beta tester. I am sure many can remember the DRV model with the immense super slide that was re-engineered three times and ultimately the model discontinued. The one Montana model where the slide room always tipped out during towing. Lippert, after gobbling up the majority of trailer frame makers, or manufacturers gobbling up smaller ones that made their own frames and increasing margin changing to Lippert frame, having the same running gear problems and frame integrity issues whether GD, Jayco, Forest River, and so on...

    My intention is not to stir a debate but to educate because I have the benefit of knowledge at all sides because of my training and profession as well as my unique interaction with the RV manufacturers and long-time ownership. However, need not even take my word or ponder what I say but just open up the owner's manual to "slideout systems" or similarly titled. Unless we are talking Newell/Prevost/Liberty Coach/SpaceCraft, it will be there as it is both the RV manufacturer's written policy as well as Lippert's written policy. Beyond this, I can also tell you that every slide mechanism has telltales of improper operation just as anything mechanical does, and from personal experience Lippert is definitely a guilty until you prove yourself innocent state!
    Rob & Nikki + Cloverfield
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  7. #17
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geotex1 View Post
    NB,

    I understand what you are attempting to drive at, but your understanding has a base flaw. The factory floor is level. All trailers on the line, 5er or TT, are sitting on their front jack(s) or on stands. All of them. So they're firmly planted on their wheels but have 3 or 4 points of support and are level. Yes, I have been to all of the major manufacturers' lines as well as the semi-custom and full-custom builders. The factory does not install or operate the slide with the frame in any sort of torsion, which is what you will encounter the majority of the time. Further, especially with through frame mechanisms, the operation relies on gravity to help stand the box - there's no mechanical control at the top on these. For the deeper and longer boxes, being out of level and/or twisted is very hard on the rather primitive system.

    A lot of dealers give bad advise that the buyer will be fine... Believing anything an RV dealer says is just gambling. Plenty of misunderstanding on the internet forums too. Neither will pay for the repairs should they be needed. Will weekend warriors' odds be in their favor and not have an issue not being level and repeated doing this? Could be. Those of use who camp longer and move more frequently, not so much. More like a matter of time.

    The mass produced frames and mechanisms, as best stated, are designed but not engineered. The "design" also involves immense trial and error, and unfortunately the retail customer is also the beta tester. I am sure many can remember the DRV model with the immense super slide that was re-engineered three times and ultimately the model discontinued. The one Montana model where the slide room always tipped out during towing. Lippert, after gobbling up the majority of trailer frame makers, or manufacturers gobbling up smaller ones that made their own frames and increasing margin changing to Lippert frame, having the same running gear problems and frame integrity issues whether GD, Jayco, Forest River, and so on...

    My intention is not to stir a debate but to educate because I have the benefit of knowledge at all sides because of my training and profession as well as my unique interaction with the RV manufacturers and long-time ownership. However, need not even take my word or ponder what I say but just open up the owner's manual to "slideout systems" or similarly titled. Unless we are talking Newell/Prevost/Liberty Coach/SpaceCraft, it will be there as it is both the RV manufacturer's written policy as well as Lippert's written policy. Beyond this, I can also tell you that every slide mechanism has telltales of improper operation just as anything mechanical does, and from personal experience Lippert is definitely a guilty until you prove yourself innocent state!
    What did you want me to look up in my manual??
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  8. #18
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    Our manual states that the trailer should first be leveled before extending the slide. So we've made it a practice to level and stabilize first, before extending, and retracting the slide before raising stabilizers or un-leveling. And of course, always fully extending and retracting and holding the button for a few seconds after the motors "amp out" as recommended. That's kept everything in sync so far.
    Chad
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  9. #19
    Site Sponsor NB Canada's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riverbug View Post
    Our manual states that the trailer should first be leveled before extending the slide. So we've made it a practice to level and stabilize first, before extending, and retracting the slide before raising stabilizers or un-leveling.
    Yes I know
    The issue is the stabilizers IMO. I can without a doubt say that every camper that pulled in and out beside us this season (likely over 50 units) all used an impact gun to stabilize. As I have stated I always level my trailer with the axles then deploy slides then stabilize

    The shorter the trailer ,like yours, imo they flex much less
    The reflections like in this post have auto leveling. To think there is minimal torque applied to the frame and body when auto leveling on these long units can be a problem IMO
    IF I owned an auto leveling coach I would always still level with the axles first then deploy slides then hit the auto level
    2021 Imagine 2400 BH
    2018 GMC Sierra 4x4 Crew 1840lb payload

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by NB Canada View Post
    Yes I know
    The issue is the stabilizers IMO. I can without a doubt say that every camper that pulled in and out beside us this season (likely over 50 units) all used an impact gun to stabilize. As I have stated I always level my trailer with the axles then deploy slides then stabilize

    The shorter the trailer ,like yours, imo they flex much less
    The reflections like in this post have auto leveling. To think there is minimal torque applied to the frame and body when auto leveling on these long units can be a problem IMO
    IF I owned an auto leveling coach I would always still level with the axles first then deploy slides then hit the auto level
    Sorry, that wasn't directed to you. Was just posting to the general thread and OP.
    Chad
    2023 23LDE 965W Solar, Victron Multiplus, Solar Controllers, Cerbo GX, 4x280AH DIY Lithium Batteries, SeeLevel Tank Monitoring, Shock Absorbers (Replaced 2022 22MLE)
    2022 F350 6.7L Superduty, Carbonized Gray, Ultimate Lariat Pkg, 4WD, Crew Cab, 160" Wheelbase, 3.55EL Rear End, 3566# Payload
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