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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhittleBurner View Post
    If and when electric takes over there will have to be charge stations as there are gas stations now. They will not be free. What everyone thinks right now about how cheap it is, that will change. People will not put them up unless they can make good money off it. States will get a lot more involved in taxing people to replace the money they lose off gas. It will cost as much to drive electric as it does gas. People will not lose their their business's and states will not give up a big revenue source without replacing it.
    The big difference is we or any other country won't be relying on another country setting the price of electricity. I don't care if I'd have to pay for electricity or not. The good thing is the price won't be fluctuating because of some other country's cut backs on oil production.

  2. #62
    Long Hauler huntindog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goducks14 View Post
    The big difference is we or any other country won't be relying on another country setting the price of electricity. I don't care if I'd have to pay for electricity or not. The good thing is the price won't be fluctuating because of some other country's cut backs on oil production.
    The present situation isn't something that just happened out of our control. It was a deliberate decision made by our present leaders who told the public what they would do if elected... They got elected because the people did not understand cause and effect... IOW, they did not understand all of the consequences an attack on the American fossil fuel industry would have.. And a lot of them still don't.
    Fossil fuels are an integral part of modern society. The device you are using to access this forum is made up of many parts that are derived from them. As are most items in our lives. Driving up the cost of fossil fuels drives up the cost of EVERYTHING.... Not just the price one pays at the pump. Look around you at all of the things we now take for granted, that are only possible because of them...
    Last edited by huntindog; 12-03-2022 at 01:31 PM.
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  3. #63
    Site Sponsor ajg617's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goducks14 View Post
    The big difference is we or any other country won't be relying on another country setting the price of electricity. I don't care if I'd have to pay for electricity or not. The good thing is the price won't be fluctuating because of some other country's cut backs on oil production.
    Wish that were true. The NH PUC approved a price increase per kilowatt-hour of 112% in August for our electrical distributor. That raised consumer bills from Eversource by 53% mostly due to cost of LP which fuels plants producing about 25% of in state electricity. We are nearly 60% nuclear (one plant - no redundancy), balance hyrdo/bio. We produce more than we need and sell excess to Canada.

    Interestingly, though Eversource is our provider, we are free to purchase from another supplier - which we did and cut 40% of the increase. The PUC granted just a 6 month rate increase for Eversource so who knows where it will be in January 2023.

    Point being, cost of electricity is anything but stable once you factor in state PUCs, the FERC, interstate commerce clauses, and bilateral contract negotiations.

  4. #64
    Site Team WhittleBurner's Avatar
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    Just a couple of years ago we were not dependent on any0ne but ourselves. We were supplying all our own oil. Not until the oil companies were told to stop producing did we become so dependent on other countries.
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  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhittleBurner View Post
    Just a couple of years ago we were not dependent on any0ne but ourselves. We were supplying all our own oil. Not until the oil companies were told to stop producing did we become so dependent on other countries.
    Who told the oil companies to stop producing? No one. Last I saw they do what they want. We've never supplied all our own oil.

  6. #66
    Long Hauler huntindog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goducks14 View Post
    Who told the oil companies to stop producing? No one. Last I saw they do what they want. We've never supplied all our own oil.
    Only technically true. 2 years ago we were a net exporter. Some of what we produced could not get to places where it was need in a manner that made financial sense. So it was exported and we imported some oil in the areas that needed it.
    The bottom line is that being a net exporter is very desirable as it holds prices down.
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  7. #67
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    https://thehill.com/policy/energy-en...e-global-deal/

    The last guy encouraged production cuts too. Politics aside, antitrust laws prevent coordination on the cuts. While supply is down, the futures market has been relatively stable, and crude has stayed lower than it ever was at it's peak in 2008-09. The only thing that has increased is BP, Exxon, Chevron, Shell, etc's profit margins.

  8. #68
    Site Team WhittleBurner's Avatar
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    Sorry I got involved I know better. This is getting way too political and we need to tone it down. I apologize again.
    Marcy & Gary
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  9. #69
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    No worries. When anything gets too expensive, people will begin searching for lower cost alternatives. Every time fuel costs go up, they're speeding up their demise.

    This was a perfect storm. Demand dropped during the pandemic, supplies were at record highs, prices plummeted. The producers started cutting production. Right when demand goes up, a major source of oil becomes unusable. The cost of the starting product doesn't go up, but thanks to a perceived scarcity we lose, while the boards rake in massive bonuses.

    On the upside, those new factories are good for me. I work for the company that's building a number of them.

  10. #70
    Site Sponsor Corky2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goducks14 View Post
    Who told the oil companies to stop producing? No one. Last I saw they do what they want. We've never supplied all our own oil.
    When new national oil drilling permits are being restricted and the national/global agenda is to transition away from fossil fuel energy, petroleum corporations will stop investing in future growth and find alternative methods to be profitable which is switching back to importing more crude and refining at aging existing plants to meet the growing demand that still exists. This drives up the cost to the consumer.

    As already mentioned this unfortunate situation is self inflicted driven by a nation/global agenda to transition to a new energy source that is not viable at this time and won't be a viable solution for the foreseeable future. Some European nations are starting to realize this now that winter is setting in.
    Last edited by Corky2; 12-04-2022 at 04:18 AM.
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