Diesel fuel additives

[Jomani]

I was a diesel mechanic back in the 80’s and can tell you that this was a debate even back then as well - long before the low sulfur standards were introduced.

A few years ago, Cummins started hedging their bet - previously recommended against fuel additives. Now they are suggesting it due to inconsistent fuel quality.

“Cummins, on the other hand, last year officially endorsed a fuel additive for the first time, recommending two Power Service products, Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost and Diesel Fuel Supplement + Cetane Boost.
Cummins engines are designed, developed, rated and built to both certify and operate efficiently on commercially available diesel fuel,” said Josh Hahn, coolants and chemicals business leader at Cummins Filtration. “However, Cummins recognizes that there are poor quality fuels on the market which don’t always meet ASTM D975 [the U.S. diesel fuel standard], and these fuel issues can result in a variety of issues for the customer, such as poor lubricity, low cetane numbers, low temperature operability issues, or injector deposits. Some cold weather operations may also call for the use of fuel additives when pour-point depressants, wax-crystal modifiers or de-icers are needed.”

Below is a link to the article this quote came from. A good read that will leave you scratching your head...

https://www.truckinginfo.com/303998/...itives-for-you

[huntindog]

I was a diesel mechanic back in the 80’s and can tell you that this was a debate even back then as well - long before the low sulfur standards were introduced.

A few years ago, Cummins started hedging their bet - previously recommended against fuel additives. Now they are suggesting it due to inconsistent fuel quality.

“Cummins, on the other hand, last year officially endorsed a fuel additive for the first time, recommending two Power Service products, Diesel Kleen + Cetane Boost and Diesel Fuel Supplement + Cetane Boost.
Cummins engines are designed, developed, rated and built to both certify and operate efficiently on commercially available diesel fuel,” said Josh Hahn, coolants and chemicals business leader at Cummins Filtration. “However, Cummins recognizes that there are poor quality fuels on the market which don’t always meet ASTM D975 [the U.S. diesel fuel standard], and these fuel issues can result in a variety of issues for the customer, such as poor lubricity, low cetane numbers, low temperature operability issues, or injector deposits. Some cold weather operations may also call for the use of fuel additives when pour-point depressants, wax-crystal modifiers or de-icers are needed.”

Below is a link to the article this quote came from. A good read that will leave you scratching your head...

https://www.truckinginfo.com/303998/...itives-for-you

Cummins went into a "partnership" with power service.
IOW, They figured that if people want to buy it, they might as well make money on it.

This is the same thing that has been going on since before the horse and buggy age.

[ajg617]

I was a diesel mechanic back in the 80’s and can tell you that this was a debate even back then as well - long before the low sulfur standards were introduced.

due to inconsistent fuel quality.

That's the pull quote and exactly true today. This isn't a CP4 only issue. Diesel quality has always been a question mark for cars. I've been running additives in diesel since the '70s. Personal preference but recommended by GM (alcohol free), Perkins (general purpose), and Volvo Penta (kerosene only) even then. How long has that auto diesel been sitting in a gas station tank where the prices are high and the traffic light?

My VP44 failed in 2007 and the Bosch replacement had a warranty insert that specifically stated any use of biodiesel voided the warranty - and Bosch had reason given the questionable sources of biodiesel. Collecting waste vegetable oil from restaurants was big business around here. Winter fuel is even more of a concern.

The ASTM D 975 standard does not specify the cold flow requirements of diesel fuel for winter. There is no legislation mandating when winter diesel should be available in each state or how individual suppliers meet the suggestions found in ASTM D 975. All complicated if the local mom & pop biodiesel 'refinery' is pumping in some questionable quality stuff at any given supply point. There's really no way to tell what additives are being put in or not.

Still have gel episodes because "winter-ready" diesel is not standardized in the US. My kids got a week off when the local supplier experimented with adding more paraffin for their winter blend - no school bus would start. I've also gotten tanks cut with kerosene. This past winter, we were draining the water from my son's F-550 6.0L every tank after the water in fuel light would go on - that went to every few tanks with an additive. He filled up at branded stations not gray market.

[ManageIT]

That's the pull quote and exactly true today. This isn't a CP4 only issue. Diesel quality has always been a question mark for cars. I've been running additives in diesel since the '70s. Personal preference but recommended by GM (alcohol free), Perkins (general purpose), and Volvo Penta (kerosene only) even then. How long has that auto diesel been sitting in a gas station tank where the prices are high and the traffic light?

My VP44 failed in 2007 and the Bosch replacement had a warranty insert that specifically stated any use of biodiesel voided the warranty - and Bosch had reason given the questionable sources of biodiesel. Collecting waste vegetable oil from restaurants was big business around here. Winter fuel is even more of a concern.

The ASTM D 975 standard does not specify the cold flow requirements of diesel fuel for winter. There is no legislation mandating when winter diesel should be available in each state or how individual suppliers meet the suggestions found in ASTM D 975. All complicated if the local mom & pop biodiesel 'refinery' is pumping in some questionable quality stuff at any given supply point. There's really no way to tell what additives are being put in or not.

Still have gel episodes because "winter-ready" diesel is not standardized in the US. My kids got a week off when the local supplier experimented with adding more paraffin for their winter blend - no school bus would start. I've also gotten tanks cut with kerosene. This past winter, we were draining the water from my son's F-550 6.0L every tank after the water in fuel light would go on - that went to every few tanks with an additive. He filled up at branded stations not gray market.

Water in fuel is nasty. My truck is in the shop now for a $12,500 fuel system replacement. Filled up to come home from last trip and got a massive amount of water. Truck ran doggy, but the only "light" I got was a short, low fuel pressure notice. Topped it off halfway home and it ran pretty normal the rest of the way.
Took into the shop to have them look at it. Fuel sample showed 40% water and destroyed fuel system with metal everywhere.
Thankfully, insurance is covering all but our deductible.

[robmcqueen]

Its almost not worth owning a diesel that not still under warranty. If your not towing over 10k lbs there are some good gas options out there that will get the job done.

[huntindog]

QUOTE=ManageIT;456755]Water in fuel is nasty. My truck is in the shop now for a $12,500 fuel system replacement. Filled up to come home from last trip and got a massive amount of water. Truck ran doggy, but the only "light" I got was a short, low fuel pressure notice. Topped it off halfway home and it ran pretty normal the rest of the way.
Took into the shop to have them look at it. Fuel sample showed 40% water and destroyed fuel system with metal everywhere.
Thankfully, insurance is covering all but the deductible

what additive were you using

[pilotpip]

Water in fuel is nasty. My truck is in the shop now for a $12,500 fuel system replacement. Filled up to come home from last trip and got a massive amount of water. Truck ran doggy, but the only "light" I got was a short, low fuel pressure notice. Topped it off halfway home and it ran pretty normal the rest of the way.
Took into the shop to have them look at it. Fuel sample showed 40% water and destroyed fuel system with metal everywhere.
Thankfully, insurance is covering all but our deductible.

Water is a big problem in diesel/kerosene/Jet-A. It suspends easily in the fuel where in gasoline it settles to the bottom of the tank quickly because the specific gravities aren't as close. The fuel tanks on the lear I fly are sumped regularly because of this.

I would suspect this will cause more problems given the current "shortage". Fuel will not be allowed to sit in the tank before dispensing which would allow some of that water to come out of suspension. All the more reason I'm glad I switched my 350 order to the 7.3L.

[ManageIT]

QUOTE=ManageIT;456755]Water in fuel is nasty. My truck is in the shop now for a $12,500 fuel system replacement. Filled up to come home from last trip and got a massive amount of water. Truck ran doggy, but the only "light" I got was a short, low fuel pressure notice. Topped it off halfway home and it ran pretty normal the rest of the way.
Took into the shop to have them look at it. Fuel sample showed 40% water and destroyed fuel system with metal everywhere.
Thankfully, insurance is covering all but the deductible

what additive were you using

I usually use Optilube. I have used Hotshot a time or two since I can get it a little easier.

[ManageIT]

Water is a big problem in diesel/kerosene/Jet-A. It suspends easily in the fuel where in gasoline it settles to the bottom of the tank quickly because the specific gravities aren't as close. The fuel tanks on the lear I fly are sumped regularly because of this.

I would suspect this will cause more problems given the current "shortage". Fuel will not be allowed to sit in the tank before dispensing which would allow some of that water to come out of suspension. All the more reason I'm glad I switched my 350 order to the 7.3L.

I'm seriously considering the 7.3 for my next truck after this. Looking at a disaster prevention kit install for a little more peace of mind for now.

[huntindog]

I usually use Optilube. I have used Hotshot a time or two since I can get it a little easier.

I remember some past conversations online where some said that additives that dispersed water would allow it to get past the filter....defeating the water in fuel warning.