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  1. #11
    Seasoned Camper
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    I’m gonna think out loud here a minute, so feel free to shoot holes in this:

    So this situation may argue for the lithium batts to be kept as a separate system to power an inverter(s), while keeping one or two LA batts to run the coach 12v systems. In this way the lithiums can be kept at a certain lesser state of charge for the long term while hooked to shore power over long periods.
    ??
    This is what I was planning anyway, but might offer a side benefit I didn’t realize?
    Larry and JoAnna
    ‘23 Chevy 3500HD CCLB DRW High Country 6.6L Diesel, ‘22 Solitude 310GK-R, Hensley BD5
    MORRyde 8k IS, QD8000 Genny, Dual 5kVA Quattros
    Dual SOK 48V 100ah Server Rack Batts (10kWHr)

  2. #12
    Long Hauler
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMagelitz View Post
    I’m gonna think out loud here a minute, so feel free to shoot holes in this:

    So this situation may argue for the lithium batts to be kept as a separate system to power an inverter(s), while keeping one or two LA batts to run the coach 12v systems. In this way the lithiums can be kept at a certain lesser state of charge for the long term while hooked to shore power over long periods.
    ??
    This is what I was planning anyway, but might offer a side benefit I didn’t realize?
    Simply put, it is never recommended, nor a good idea, to mix battery chemistries on the same charger. The charger will either under charge the LiFePO4 batteries, or over charge the LA batteries (which could pose a for hazard). Then you have the real possibility of the LiFePO4 batteries charging the LA batteries and the converter trying to charge both.

    EDIT: unless you buy a separate charger for the LiFePO4 batteries. So now you will be plugging in your coach and an extension cable for the LiFePO4 charger, the extension cord should be at least a 6 GA or bigger to avoid getting hot and possibly catching fire. Most LiFePO4 chargers state not to use an extension cable with them.
    Last edited by MoonShadow_1911; 02-17-2023 at 09:02 PM.
    Mark & Mary. Full-timing across the USA (and Canada)!
    Current Coach: 2021 Grand Design Reflection 320MKS
    Current Rig: 2019 Ford F350 SD Crew Cab, w/8' box, Lariat, SRW, 6.7l Diesel

  3. #13
    Seasoned Camper
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    Quote Originally Posted by MoonShadow_1911 View Post
    Simply put, it is never recommended, nor a good idea, to mix battery chemistries on the same charger. The charger will either under charge the LiFePO4 batteries, or over charge the LA batteries (which could pose a for hazard). Then you have the real possibility of the LiFePO4 batteries charging the LA batteries and the converter trying to charge both.

    EDIT: unless you buy a separate charger for the LiFePO4 batteries. So now you will be plugging in your coach and an extension cable for the LiFePO4 charger, the extension cord should be at least a 6 GA or bigger to avoid getting hot and possibly catching fire. Most LiFePO4 chargers state not to use an extension cable with them.
    Yeah I got lazy and didn’t elaborate enough. The inverter/chargers would take care of charging/discharging the lithiums, and the normal onboard converter will continue to take care of the LAs. I have to keep them separate anyway cause I’m planning on a 48v LiFePO4 bank.
    Larry and JoAnna
    ‘23 Chevy 3500HD CCLB DRW High Country 6.6L Diesel, ‘22 Solitude 310GK-R, Hensley BD5
    MORRyde 8k IS, QD8000 Genny, Dual 5kVA Quattros
    Dual SOK 48V 100ah Server Rack Batts (10kWHr)

  4. #14
    Fireside Member
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    So glad I haven't picked up LI batteries yet. I felt this coming. I like to stay hooked up a lot. Boondocking sometimes.
    What's next? Always something!
    Retired U.S. Navy Engineer

    2020 Ram 2500 Big Horn, CC, 6.7 Cummins
    2022 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS

  5. #15
    Site Team xrated's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by markandkim View Post
    So glad I haven't picked up LI batteries yet. I felt this coming. I like to stay hooked up a lot. Boondocking sometimes.
    What's next? Always something!
    There's actually a very easy solution to this. You simply add a battery disconnect switch inline with the Positive lead coming off of the battery. In my case, it is a 300A Blue Seas brand and with that switch open, zero charging current goes to the battery. It's no different electrically, than disconnecting the pos. lead from the battery terminal. While you are plugged into shore power, the converter/charger will supply 12VDC to the rest of the trailer for lights, fridge control power, etc. Then, when you are ready to hook up and travel, you simply turn the battery disconnect back on, and do your hook up to the truck and travel to your destination. Or, turn the battery disconnect switch back on several hours before hookup and travel time to insure that the batteries are fully charged before travel and start up the fridge so that it is cooled down and ready to be used....especially if you have a 12VDC compressor type fridge like I do.
    Last edited by xrated; 02-18-2023 at 06:10 AM.
    2016 F350 CrewCab Dually
    2018 Momentum 394M...Heavily Modded!
    2023 Suzuki GSX-S1000 GT+
    Excessive Payload is a Wonderful Thing

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  6. #16
    Fireside Member
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    They give you a 12v fridge, a 165w solar panel, 50 amp charge controller and a single 50ah LA battery.
    Now instead of a 200ah LI battery, do I need to consider AGM's?
    I was really looking forward to the LI battery set up.
    Retired U.S. Navy Engineer

    2020 Ram 2500 Big Horn, CC, 6.7 Cummins
    2022 Grand Design Reflection 315RLTS

  7. #17
    Site Sponsor
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    I bought two 300 AH life batteries then our camping style changed from boondocking to RV parks with amenities. Each battery has it's own cut off switch on the positive cable so I can run either or both batteries.

    What I do is keep one battery off ( I alternate) and turn the charging system off on the inverter, I only charge the batteries with solar. This way the battery drains down at night (maybe to 70%) with the furnace and recharges during the day (most days) being in the desert. This is the best way I can think of to use/extend battery life.

    I will say if I had a Victron multiplus II inverter I wouldn't even plug in and save on our electricity bill. But with an older style inverter/charger and a sub panel without the water heater and AC's connected this is what I do.
    Location - Wherever the road takes us...Full-timers
    2015 Momentum 380
    2019 Ram Dually

  8. #18
    Site Team WhittleBurner's Avatar
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    For us Lithium doesn't make sense. We don't boon dock a lot anymore which means we are always plugged in. We replaced our golf cart batteries last year with two more TL6 golf cart batteries. To change out now would make no sense. With the high cost of the batteries and having to replace the converter we would never see any improvement from what we have now. Who knows what we will be doing 8 years from now, but very likely we would not still be in the same trailer. I don't think I would ever know the difference so I will not go the the expense.
    Marcy & Gary
    2014 Grand Design - Reflection 303RLS
    2022 GMC 3500 Denali Duramax Longbed SRW
    2015 GMC Denali 3500 - Retired
    2003 F350 - retired
    Michigan
    We're in trouble now, the dog are bloggin'!
    https://3dogsandatrailer.wordpress.com/


  9. #19
    Rolling Along
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    Wow. Wayyyy TOOOOO much over-thinking here, guys (and gals).

    With a proper charger, LiFePo chemistries are not damaged by being hooked up to shore power as the charger will not overcharge or improperly maintain the battery.

    Yes, it will partially cycle the battery and keep it topped off, but that is such an insignificant issue. I'm rather baffled it's getting this much discussion.

    Most LiFePo cells are rated for THOUSANDS of complete cycles before the cells reach 80% of advertised capacity. I'm not sure of the specifics of BB cells, but I imagine they are rated in the 3-5 thousand cycles range. That means you can cycle your battery from 100%>0%>100% for at least 3,000 times before your battery degrades 20%. Think about that. If you cycled the battery once a day, that's 8 YEARS before you reach 80% of original capacity.

    Now consider the 1-3% cycle "loss" per day on shore power. Let's take the higher 3% a day. It would take over a month to reach a full discharge/charger cycle. A MONTH! So that's 3,000 MONTHS (250 years) before your battery would reach 80% of its original capacity AND you're STILL @ 80% even then.

    Unless you are buying batteries with used or Grade B cells that are already at the 80% (which BB doesn't use), don't worry about anything except having the right charger and make sure it's programmed for the right chemistry.

    Now, whether LiFePo batteries are worth the additional cost if you're always on shore power is a different discussion...

  10. #20
    Long Hauler
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    Quote Originally Posted by A.Texas.Yankee View Post
    Wow. Wayyyy TOOOOO much over-thinking here, guys (and gals).

    With a proper charger, LiFePo chemistries are not damaged by being hooked up to shore power as the charger will not overcharge or improperly maintain the battery.

    Yes, it will partially cycle the battery and keep it topped off, but that is such an insignificant issue. I'm rather baffled it's getting this much discussion.

    Most LiFePo cells are rated for THOUSANDS of complete cycles before the cells reach 80% of advertised capacity. I'm not sure of the specifics of BB cells, but I imagine they are rated in the 3-5 thousand cycles range. That means you can cycle your battery from 100%>0%>100% for at least 3,000 times before your battery degrades 20%. Think about that. If you cycled the battery once a day, that's 8 YEARS before you reach 80% of original capacity.

    Now consider the 1-3% cycle "loss" per day on shore power. Let's take the higher 3% a day. It would take over a month to reach a full discharge/charger cycle. A MONTH! So that's 3,000 MONTHS (250 years) before your battery would reach 80% of its original capacity AND you're STILL @ 80% even then.

    Unless you are buying batteries with used or Grade B cells that are already at the 80% (which BB doesn't use), don't worry about anything except having the right charger and make sure it's programmed for the right chemistry.

    Now, whether LiFePo batteries are worth the additional cost if you're always on shore power is a different discussion...
    I did state in my first post if anyone wanted the engineering and scientific data. You kind of summed it up here, though. [emoji41]
    Mark & Mary. Full-timing across the USA (and Canada)!
    Current Coach: 2021 Grand Design Reflection 320MKS
    Current Rig: 2019 Ford F350 SD Crew Cab, w/8' box, Lariat, SRW, 6.7l Diesel

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