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  1. #11
    Seasoned Camper msutoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by geotex1 View Post
    @msutoad, greetings fellow engineer! OK, first thing first, on your parts bags those are GD P/Ns, which change surprisingly frequently. The numbers you want to pay attention too are those in the lower left corner below the bar code. The righthand bag is a Lippert-supplied bushing and the right is a Dexter-supplied bushing. Standard P/Ns for each. These are both sintered bronze, and Dexter follows an internal specification that they won't share but I believe is close to SAE 841 material. At last I knew for spec, Lippert buys open market, Asia-produced bearings. There are several grades of bronze slightly magnetic, and in sintered you can have different additions. I move to SAE 660 bushings that I had sourced directly from manufacturer.

    Is it consistently with that equalizer but a different bushing in it each time? If so, I'd focus on checking if there is to much side-to-side or rotational play.

    thanks so much for your reply, and again the time you are taking to share what is quite important to me.

    my sharing of the GDRV part #s and diff bushings was to highlight only that I got diff ones from them .

    attached is a pic of new cre3000 equalizer that was installed and the circled locations were toast in 1200 miles.
    Based on the shackles I have, I thought they were the Heavy Duty ones. How would I know if they are they heavy duty ones??


    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by msutoad; 03-07-2023 at 07:11 AM.
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  2. #12
    Site Sponsor Steven@147's Avatar
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    I'm getting ready to do the bushing dance myself. It's been three years @ 13,000 miles since I last did mine. I have no idea what I'm going to find when I do the job. It's not a job requiring a mechanical degree , but its time consuming, crawling around on the ground, tough getting the rig jacked up, difficult to get the springs eyes lined up to get the bolts back in and so forth. For the time you spend doing the job you wish it would last longer.

    But part quality is the kind of thing that drives me nuts, like bushings and the material they are made from. I wouldn't put it past some manufacturers to cheapen out and make them out of cheaper material but charge like they are premier quality. So what's a guy to do? For me, the only thing I can do is just order stuff from a company that has a good reputation, like MORryde and just trust to luck that what you pay for you get! It seems from consumers they have earned a good rep. But even though companies that have a good reputation, make a good product, they can't be held responsible for the job someone else did installing or a mechanical problem that causes their part to go bad faster.
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  3. #13
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    I have no idea why these bushings aren't a hard metal on both sides. Ever see how something like an excavator is put together? It has pin connection points that are exactly like what we have in a spring hanger. Exactly 0 of these joints will be a hard pin (steel) to a soft bushing (brass/bronze). They are all steel to steel, which works because all those joints are intended to be greased regularly.

    On trailers, it seems that we figure out the greasing part (wet bolts), but neglected the sleeves; you don't want a soft metal riding on a hard metal in a greased joint, you want hard to hard. A soft metal riding on hard is something that's used in a sacrificial joint, where the soft metal is intended to wear away to "lubricate" and protect the hard metal. I'm just not sure why we're not using steel bushings vs brass or bronze, unless it's to protect from a dry joint (steel to steel won't last long if you have no grease in it).

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by msutoad View Post
    thanks so much for your reply, and again the time you are taking to share what is quite important to me.

    my sharing of the GDRV part #s and diff bushings was to highlight only that I got diff ones from them .

    attached is a pic of new cre3000 equalizer that was installed and the circled locations were toast in 1200 miles.
    Based on the shackles I have, I thought they were the Heavy Duty ones. How would I know if they are they heavy duty ones??


    Click image for larger version. 

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    Those are the heavy duty shackles. But the areas you circled are the pins, not the shackle (the shackle is the part going from your circle on the left down to the other wet bolt, the steel that's holding the equalizer to the spring eye).

    The middle circle, that should not have burned up in 1000 miles. I had ~10,000 miles on mine and all but one of the bushings in the CRE itself were fine. The one that wasn't had a small flat spot inside, but it wasn't that bad (and likely my fault for not greasing enough). The one you have circled on the left, that's the one that was completely shot on mine in ~10K miles, just obliterated, it was hard to see on some of the springs that there was ever even a bushing in there.

  5. #15
    Site Team traveldawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msutoad View Post
    I am having discussions with MorRyde on the Brass bushings prematurely wearing out even when greased properly. I have confirmed weights (from the scales) and all the suspensions measurements. So I am wondering how many on here have replaced their bushings and how many miles were on yours? My challenge is swapping bushings at the rate I am wearing them out is not sustainable.

    Please reply to this thread and let me know please as I would like to make a comment to MorRyde that I am not alone, I just happen to be someone that has climbed the chain to address it . Thanks in advance.

    Jason
    Jason, My bushing were all worn on a SRE4000 hanger and the spring shackle business when I had them removed. Can't tell you if the were bronze or brass other than it probably took less than 5000 miles to wear out. I put them on when I installed the SRE4000 and heavy duty shackles & bushings from MorRyde.

    My suggestion, while a bit labor intensive and maybe a bit expensive if you have to pay someone, would be to replace them at every bearing repack. They just don't last - at least not on any good size/weigh RV.

    I wasn't surprised at the wear on the spring hanger ends, but even the bushing in the SRE4000 was worn - that kind of surprised me. I figure those spring ends are never quite round but figure the machining on the SRE4000 suspension part would be better.
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  6. #16
    Long Hauler huntindog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overtaxed View Post
    I have no idea why these bushings aren't a hard metal on both sides. Ever see how something like an excavator is put together? It has pin connection points that are exactly like what we have in a spring hanger. Exactly 0 of these joints will be a hard pin (steel) to a soft bushing (brass/bronze). They are all steel to steel, which works because all those joints are intended to be greased regularly.

    On trailers, it seems that we figure out the greasing part (wet bolts), but neglected the sleeves; you don't want a soft metal riding on a hard metal in a greased joint, you want hard to hard. A soft metal riding on hard is something that's used in a sacrificial joint, where the soft metal is intended to wear away to "lubricate" and protect the hard metal. I'm just not sure why we're not using steel bushings vs brass or bronze, unless it's to protect from a dry joint (steel to steel won't last long if you have no grease in it).
    there are no seals to keep the grease where it is needed. most of the grease has been pushed out before you get on the highway,
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by huntindog View Post
    there are no seals to keep the grease where it is needed. most of the grease has been pushed out before you get on the highway,
    That's fair, but my F450 doesn't have seals either. It doesn't even have a wet bolt, it's just a bolt through a machined hole in the spring and good for 100K miles or so.

    If the bushing is smooth and the pin is smooth, it doesn't take much grease to keep the joint happy, in fact, it takes almost none because there's very little friction with a smooth joint. A sealed joint would be better, but just a dead on simple and standard joint like you'd see on any tractor front end loader would work fine, a hard bushing with a hard pin and a grease zerk.

    This is a fixable problem. And the fix doesn't have to cost 1000's, in fact, it might not cost 100 bucks to put in good, pressed in bushings that will last and are round from the factory.

  8. #18
    Seasoned Camper msutoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Overtaxed View Post
    Those are the heavy duty shackles. But the areas you circled are the pins, not the shackle (the shackle is the part going from your circle on the left down to the other wet bolt, the steel that's holding the equalizer to the spring eye).

    The middle circle, that should not have burned up in 1000 miles. I had ~10,000 miles on mine and all but one of the bushings in the CRE itself were fine. The one that wasn't had a small flat spot inside, but it wasn't that bad (and likely my fault for not greasing enough). The one you have circled on the left, that's the one that was completely shot on mine in ~10K miles, just obliterated, it was hard to see on some of the springs that there was ever even a bushing in there.
    Yeah sorry, I didnt mean to suggest that the circles were my interpretation of "do I have heavy duty shackles". The circles was more to denote the location of the last 2 bushings that I scorched on my 2 trips to FL.

    Yeah, some of my spring bushings were totally gone at 5K miles, and I didnt replace them all until I got to 10K because I didnt know any better. So by the time I got to 10K, yeah they were 80% gone and came out in pieces.

    While I wish this was not the case, I am glad that I am not the only one seeing these issues of wear. My expectations might be off as to how fast I should be replacing them, which is completely possible. I do have a set of never fail LCI bushings, but I have not yet decided if/when I might try those also. In the meantime, I am waiting on 2 new shackle wet bolts from GDRV so I can swap these out since I need new bolts and nuts before I make my next pull to FL in 3 weeks .

    Thanks again for the conversation back and forth here. I appreciate the details, and again your time. The forum has been a great place to learn and share my experiences, and I am by far no expert. Interestingly, I never had this problem on my horse trailer because it does not have spring suspension like this at all, so no wonder I never knew about such a thing having pulled those for a decade (40 foot with living quarters) without these items to consider.

    Thanks again
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  9. #19
    Rolling Along
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    I’m starting to wonder if it really matters if they are worn out. Seems folks replace them when grease will not go in. And find that they are all shot. I’m interested to know the risks of running with worn out bushings. When I pulled the one on my spring eye that would not take grease there was no bushing in there. And no evidence of one ever being in there. If they take grease is there a risk of breaking a greasy wet bolt. Just wondering.
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  10. #20
    Seasoned Camper msutoad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by traveldawg View Post
    Jason, My bushing were all worn on a SRE4000 hanger and the spring shackle business when I had them removed. Can't tell you if the were bronze or brass other than it probably took less than 5000 miles to wear out. I put them on when I installed the SRE4000 and heavy duty shackles & bushings from MorRyde.

    My suggestion, while a bit labor intensive and maybe a bit expensive if you have to pay someone, would be to replace them at every bearing repack. They just don't last - at least not on any good size/weigh RV.

    I wasn't surprised at the wear on the spring hanger ends, but even the bushing in the SRE4000 was worn - that kind of surprised me. I figure those spring ends are never quite round but figure the machining on the SRE4000 suspension part would be better.
    Yeah, dont disagree on doing them all during a bearing "repack/service". And I get all of this is what it is, maintenance. I hope no one sees this as me throwing shade or being angry. I just didnt know if my rig was broken, or was this normal and what did others do. I can do one side in about 3 hours start to finish now. So its 6 hours of labor to do the whole rig given the work to get it jacked up etc, and do the work (Messy too). Thanks for the info on the SRE4000 stuff too, shows its not CRE3000 specific, but I didnt think that was the case at all either.

    Thanks for your @traveldawg. I will be burning diesel headed your way in FL in a few weeks
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