Is a 48 Volt RV In Your Future?

[NB Canada]

I think you're off on this one (as I've agreed with much of what you said, albeit a bit abrasive at times). This is more than a concept, and there is planned production in the next few years. Toyota is already working "self parking" trailer software based on cameras and remote user input (along with "self driving" trailers). I imagine others will follow. I'm in the camp of EV just isn't there for me, and those that think it's a cost savings are a bit drunk on the sugary drinks. There's absolutely nothing real in saving cost wise about nearly anything "green" right now. Solar panels are a perfect example, been around for decades, and are way too costly to be a savings in any way, shape or form. What EV and green energy DOES do is provide convenience or additional options but is almost always pricey. I love solar for off grid. I like the idea of electric motors and technology and the thought of being able to pull up to a campsite and watch a computer park the rig for me. But on the other hand, it's a great feeling doing it myself and fitting 44+ feet of trailer into a tight spot, nailing it on the first time to tiny applause from the RV Park audience.

I think there is a large gap between this tiny single axle concept being built and the ability to self park a 44 foot fifth wheel. The need isn’t there but who knows, Airstream might actually build one to sell but you can guarantee it will be north of 100k. Will someone want one, likely but most won’t
The thing I don’t understand about this segment( EVs and alternative energy) why is it taking so long to develop it to a cost effective idea?
They say we all will be driving EVs soon but where is the technology allowing that?
They say it will come but why isn’t it here now?
With todays computer modeling and 3 d printers R and D can take days when only 20-30 years ago would take years
My answer is that it either can’t be done or no one wants it

[WhittleBurner]

Still waiting for our flying cars they promised us back in the 60's.

[LMagelitz]

Just to give you some idea of the energy density of Lithium Ion batteries compared to Lead Acid batteries: My 24 volt, Tesla, Model S, battery module measures ~3 inches tall, 11 inches wide and 20 inches long (it looks like a big brick). Electrically, it is 250 amp hours at ~ 24 volts. This is equivalent to 500ah at 12v, or 5 Battle Born Lithium batteries or 10 Lead Acid batteries. The whole battery module weighs less than a 12v Lead Acid battery (only 55 lbs for all that energy).

Here is a picture of the Model S battery module:

Should I be looking at these as an alternative to two SOK 48v LiFePO4 server rack batts to power a couple of Victron inverters??

[Canyonlight]

Dan, my RV is already powered by two Tesla Model S battery modules running at 24 volts.

And thank you for the kind words.

David - I do recall this and you sharing the details on this sometime ago.

Dan

[Ynot4me2]

Wow, I've managed to read through. To bad the EV subject took over most of the post. Funny how everyone gets really defensive when there's a change in the air, regardless of what that change is. When the internet was invented and they said that every house hold would have a connection, people screamed no way as we would have to re-wire the entire country.

Anyway,

I've read and see the advantages of 48v over 12v (smaller cables etc...) but is there any disadvantage other then changing/switching all of the appliances from 12v to 48v? Someone mentioned earlier that anything over 30DCv is dangerous and would require more protection. Will that protection addition offset the weight savings over todays 12v system?

[dryfly]

Just thinking after following this thread. Whether we are discussing changing our RV's to a 48 vdc system or EV's, it seems we have to keep in perspective that change occurs in every industry. Sometimes slow and sometimes fast. If we never experiment with new concepts we avoid change. Is that good?

In every new concept there are early adapters that enjoy being on the leading edge. They are the risk takers, and personally I'm glad they are of that mindset or we might all still be driving a horse and buggy.

EV's are not for everyone, especially at this point, and nobody is being forced to purchase one. But to predict the future of alternative forms of power is pure speculation. Would we have ever thought 50 years ago that we would be enjoying the many convenience and safety features of the trucks we drive today? Most due to computer chips, unheard of at the time.

[NB Canada]

Is smaller gauge wire an advantage?

Wouldn’t repair on small gauge wire be more difficult?

[jkwilson]

Is smaller gauge wire an advantage?

Wouldn’t repair on small gauge wire be more difficult?

It’s cheaper, lighter and takes up less space. No more difficult than larger wire, and easier in some cases.

Saving tiny bits of money on large scale production vehicles is a big deal. An ME I was in school with went to work for a big automaker and came up with a change that slightly improved reliability and saved something like $1.50 per vehicle and got a nice cash bonus and an in person thank you from the CEO.

[SolarPoweredRV]

But there has to be a need unfortunately or that it is “fixing” and issue but it isn’t
Neither the manufacturer or overwhelming majority of end user would benefit so why do it?
Imo they won’t. If it isn’t fixing a problem or helping sales they won’t do it. In fact it will just cost more

For Tesla the issue is reduced weight from reducing the size of all wiring, improved electrical performance, and reduced cooling requirements of the electronic components.

RV OEMs would benefit from reduced weight, improved electronic component cooling (LCI One Control, Leveling Sensors, Refrigerator and water heater control boards, etc.), Higher energy efficiency of electric motors (think Furnace and Hydraulic Pump motor).

Owners would benefit from having more on-board energy storage (50ah, 48v Lithium battery vs 50ah [usable] 12v, Lead Acid Battery), reduced weight of their RV (fuel savings), energy efficiency of on-board devices (motors, Inverters, Solar Controllers, etc.). Additionally, higher voltage would allow RV OEMs to create new devices that are not possible with the current 12 volt architecture.

RV OEMs might also be "somewhat" forced into the 48v architecture because 12v components will become less and less available and more expensive because the automotive industry is moving to 48v. Additionally, 48v motors are probably cheaper because they take less internal windings/less copper to manufacture. Additionally, battery prices on a per amp basis will probably begin to favor 48 volts when compared to 12 volts.

Edit: I forgot to mention HUGE COST SAVINGS because of using 4x less Copper in the mile long wiring harnesses.

[SolarPoweredRV]

Should I be looking at these as an alternative to two SOK 48v LiFePO4 server rack batts to power a couple of Victron inverters??

NO, I do not recommend installing the Tesla batteries in your RV. The batteries have no built-in BMS (that is accessible to DIYers) so, you have to design and develop your own BMS type battery protections. Additionally, the lower pricing of Lithium batteries reduces/eliminates the reasons to install the Model S batteries.

Of course, the Tesla batteries definitely have a "COOL" factor to them !!