I Need Suspension Advice and help - Any Experts Here?

[TucsonJim]

I made a post on anther forum regarding my worn out bushings. In that post, I provided a picture that has generated a lot of controversy and I need some guidance from fellow GD forum members to get me back on track. First of all, here is the picture in question:



The controversy arises regarding the gap between the Equa-Flex equalizer arm and the nut that you can see in the picture. It measures approximately 0.123 inches! It doesn't look right to me, and folks on the other forum are stating it's down-right wrong. I compared the bolt length of the replacement bolts I received with the rebuild kit to the original wet bolts and they are exactly the same (measured from the bottom of the head to the shoulder, and the shoulder to the end of the threads). I also compared the shackle thickness between the original and the replacement, and they too are exactly the same. I believe I had a similar gap in the original configuration, but I didn't measure it.

What do you all think? Is something wrong here, or is this normal. I've tried to contact Lippert, but no answers yet. I don't see a difference between the original components and the replacements. Does anybody have a rig with 6000# axles that they can take a look and see if there is a similar gap around their suspension components? Especially where the Equa-Flex arm shackles bolt on?

Appreciate your advice and support.

Jim

[TucsonJim]

Please note that the bolt has been pushed through as far as possible so all the gap is showing on one side. On your rigs, if there is a gap, it's probably spread between multiple spaces.

Jim

[Paul & Deb]

Jim, I'm not 100% on what you are showing me but I went outside and rolling around (with my shoulder still in my splint / sling) I managed these. Not sure if we're looking at the same areas but I don[t see ANY gaps like that anywhere in the suspension.

[LCBoyer]

I don't see a gap like that on mine. You have extra long bolts or skinny shackles

[TucsonJim]

Okay guys, I really appreciate the effort. Paul - If you hurt your shoulder crawling under the rig, please don't let the Mrs. let you know who put you up to it.

I'm feeling much better after doing some additional measurements and checking.

First of all, I compared shackle thickness from the old shackles to the new shackles. The new ones were .002 narrower. So basically, they are the same as this photo shows.


Then I compared a new bolt to an old bolt. The new bolt is .002 shorter, so it makes up the difference of the narrower shackle. Here's the pic:


Then, I had a EUREKA moment. When I removed one of the Equa-flex equalizers, I left the shackles attached and threw it in the trash. I did some dumpster diving tonight and found it! Low and behold the when I push the bolt, shackles and equalizer together, I get nearly the same gap that I have with the new set up (.003 smaller on the original set up):


Finally, I crawled back under the rig and took a look to see if the gap was visible. It looks just like yours with no gap showing. But I was able to insert a feeler gauge and found quite a bit of slop between the hard surfaces. If I added all the small gaps which weren't visible to the eye or camera, the come pretty close to the gap I'm seeing when the parts are off the rig.


So, bottom line, I'm no longer concerned. And while I was discussing it with Ginnie tonight, her comment was "you need to stop trying to second guess all the other engineers and trust them from time to time". My response was just like Détente with the Soviet Union "Trust but verify"....

Jim

[Cate&Rob]

Hi Jim,

Following this discussion . . . I don't have my trailer close by to take measurements, but the pictures you have taken don't look right. A couple of things concern me . . . 1) the obvious wide tolerance gap and . . . 2) the nut retained only by interference to the narrow shoulder on the bolt (you identified this concern earlier). I expect that you are pressuring LCI for their perspective on this and if they won't answer, I would ask GDRV to pressure them for an answer.

If I were going to "engineer" this interface, I would say that the shackle arms and the bolt are the "fixed" parts and the centre piece has to freely rotate on the (greased) bushing on the bolt. There should be a washer on each side of the pivoting part equal to half the open gap and the nut side shackle arm should be small enough that it can't get past the bolt shoulder. The nut should then come up tight against the shackle arm . . . not just the shoulder of the bolt.

Rob

[TucsonJim]

Rob - Regarding the nut being retained only by the shoulder, I did replace the nuts with nylon locking nuts in order to assure better retention. I think I will call GD tomorrow and try to understand why these rigs are built this way. I can assure you, that if mine was built this way, others must be also. And as you can see from the original shackle/Equaflex interface, the gap is consistent.


Jim

[gordofuchs]

I have a 305RE, I believe with 7,000 lb. axels. Went underneath and looked at the setup. While there was a fair amount of grease around the bolts, I did note a significant gap on both sides of the flex arm, where it meets the shackle. It appears to be close to 1/8 inch each side. The same holds true where the shackle meets the frame. While I can only speculate why it is there, to produce less stress when making tight turns, sloppy manufacturing, I don't know. This is not coming from " an expert ", but just an old guy that's been around axels and drivetrains a lot.

Gordo Fuchs
Presently at home.

[TucsonJim]

I have a 305RE, I believe with 7,000 lb. axels. Went underneath and looked at the setup. While there was a fair amount of grease around the bolts, I did note a significant gap on both sides of the flex arm, where it meets the shackle. It appears to be close to 1/8 inch each side. The same holds true where the shackle meets the frame. While I can only speculate why it is there, to produce less stress when making tight turns, sloppy manufacturing, I don't know. This is not coming from " an expert ", but just an old guy that's been around axels and drivetrains a lot.

Gordo - Thanks for the reply. Somebody else seeing the same thing makes me believe that this is the way it's designed. I hope to hear back from Lippert when they get back to work on Tuesday.

Jim

[Cate&Rob]

Gordo - Thanks for the reply. Somebody else seeing the same thing makes me believe that this is the way it's designed. I hope to hear back from Lippert when they get back to work on Tuesday.

Jim

The way it was "designed" and the way it was "built" might be two different things. I can't believe that your pictures show a viable design intent.

Rob