Dealer says truck is undersized and requires a waiver to sell it to me

[phonemannn]

The slam-dunk is folks towing trailers where the advertised dry pin-weight exceeds the payload capacity of the truck. No weighing of debris is needed to establish they were over one of the trucks "do not exceed" ratings.

I'm curious, however, how much the "incremental" damages might be for being overweight. Does being overweight open some additional litigative doorway that massively increases your exposure in a way that speeding by 5-mph or following too closely does not? Same wreck, same conditions, how much extra exposure does the overweight RV owner really have vs being entirely within specs?

That is when you have to hire a accident investigator, to re construct the wreck. If the wreck was totally preventable if the vehicles were totally legal, weight , brakes, then the formula changes.

[JColeman]

If one of my clients were in an accident with an rv, you bet I go after over weight issues. And find them, and Get lots of money for my clients because of it. It is against the law to operate a vehicle in a un -safe manner. Simple. Over weight is unsafe. Of course, this is an over simplification of an accident... O, we never call them accident, they are called wrecks! Accidents can be prevented, wrecks cannot! I see a toy hauler on a single wheel tow vehicle, Guaranteed over weight. How much? there is the question...

Bluster.

How many times have you actually litigated this type of situation? With no offense, it is only the attorneys and insurance agents who promulgate this info and I have still not been shown any evidence.

So...like in law school or any court of law, any citations to support your legal theory?

[phonemannn]

Bluster.

How many times have you actually litigated this type of situation? With no offense, it is only the attorneys and insurance agents who promulgate this info and I have still not been shown any evidence.

So...like in law school or any court of law, any citations to support your legal theory?

I litigate wrecks everyday, and yes it comes into play. You do know in California, EVERY pick up truck is regulated just like the big Diesel rigs? They are all Commercial registered. Every Nissan Toyota or Ford, Ram, And they are held to the same standards. Can you imagine a 120K Semi, which is overloaded, not having the weight come into play if there is a wreck? Think before you speak....please.

[JColeman]

I litigate wrecks everyday, and yes it comes into play. You do know in California, EVERY pick up truck is regulated just like the big Diesel rigs? They are all Commercial registered. Every Nissan Toyota or Ford, Ram, And they are held to the same standards. Can you imagine a 120K Semi, which is overloaded, not having the weight come into play if there is a wreck? Think before you speak....please.

And yet still no citations for non-commercial vehicles

[NordicNevs]

I mean if folks need to justify risk acceptance that’s on them.

But


Once you no longer even have to think about it, it becomes a non issue.


That said I guess I still have to worry about folks who hold the belief “it’s underrated it can do a lot more than the manufactures lead onto” and “there is no evidence that I will accept that changes my mind” types.

But, technically those people on here arguing the “ok” factor of being overweight are now more than aware of, and voicing, opinions on a public forum willfully accepting being overweight....so, at this point it becomes almost ignorance of issue.


I’ll just give those who are overweight configurations or appear to be overweight a wide birth when heading down the highway.



I do not believe that to be the case for the OP

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[JColeman]

I mean if folks need to justify risk acceptance that’s on them.

But


Once you no longer even have to think about it, it becomes a non issue.


That said I guess I still have to worry about folks who hold the belief “it’s underrated it can do a lot more than the manufactures lead onto” and “there is no evidence that I will accept that changes my mind” types.

But, technically those people on here arguing the “ok” factor of being overweight are now more than aware of, and voicing, opinions on a public forum willfully accepting being overweight....so, at this point it becomes almost ignorance of issue.


I’ll just give those who are overweight configurations or appear to be overweight a wide birth when heading down the highway.



I do not believe that to be the case for the OP

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I don't think anyone can logically argue that a higher rated payload on your tow vehicle is a bad thing. I certainly don't.

But I am also not going to be told that there are these huge liability issues without some actual evidence. They are two separate issues.

[backtrack2015]

And yet still no citations for non-commercial vehicles

I just did the most cursory look for information on folks getting cited or fined for being overweight. There are a few discussions on rv.net that cover this. Admittedly, I only read one, which was mostly low-IQ drivel but ended with an attorney's discussion of compensatory damages (owed for negligence, insurable) and exemplary damages (punitive, owed for reckless disregard, may not be insured...check your policy). My interpretation is if it can be shown that you "should have known" (i.e., a reasonable man would have known) you were towing overweight or towing when your brakes were not functioning properly, you could be looking at punitive damages. No thanks.

As for the OP, the dealership seems out-of-line on this to me. The truck's payload seems sufficient.

[Txfivver]

Good info backtrack, thank you and I too want nothing to do with lining a lawyers pockets. This thread has gotten waaayy to serious I think. I think we all agree the dealer was out of line with his actions. Let's really help the OP and discuss what is the best oil to run in his new truck and, more importantly, what's the best hitch to pull his new trailer with. Those should be nice calm topics. lol

[JColeman]

I will leave this here by adding that when someone posts that they "litigate wrecks every day" and yet cannot provide one single citation or case involving non-commercial vehicles, it causes me to doubt the veracity of the statement.

[phonemannn]

I will leave this here by adding that when someone posts that they "litigate wrecks every day" and yet cannot provide one single citation or case involving non-commercial vehicles, it causes me to doubt the veracity of the statement.

Ok, what ever you want to think...I have nothing to prove.
California Oversize and Overweight Fines and Penalties

Under California Vehicle Code Section 35551(a) VC, having an overweight vehicle is a criminal offense that can carry significant penalties. According to Vehicle Code § 42030(a), the fines start out small. For up to 1,000 pounds over the weight limit for a single axle, the fine is as low as $20 before fees are added. A fine for a typical overweight truck can range from five hundred ($500) to the thousand dollars. Every person convicted of a violation of any weight limitation provision of Division 15 (commencing with Section 35000), and every person convicted of a violation of Section 21461 with respect to signs provided pursuant to Section 35654 or 35752, and every person convicted of a violation of Section 40001 for requiring the operation of a vehicle upon a highway in violation of any provision referred to in this section shall be punished by a fine. In most cases driving an overweight vehicle is a misdemeanor in California law. Misdemeanor ( summary ) probation up (6) months in county jail; and/or a fine of up to one thousand dollars ($1,000).The exception is if the amount of excess weight is less than four thousand five hundred one pounds (4,501). In this case, VC 35551 is only a California infraction. The penalty for overweight vehicles as an infraction is a fine of two hundred fifty dollars ($250).

As soon as you tow anything, even a small trailer DOT mandates may apply if the GCWR is greater than 10,000 pounds. Keep in mind the regulations are not only applicable to large trucks.