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Thread: Friends home 220 power safe ?
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03-13-2022, 10:16 AM #31
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03-13-2022, 10:52 AM #32
@Traveldwg had the best method for you.
First make sure it is the correct receptacle.
Second, using a multi-meter check between leg 1 and ground for 110v
leg 2 and ground for 110v
leg 1 and common/neutral for 110v
leg 2 and common/neutral for 110v
leg 1 and leg 2 for 220v
As several have pointed out DO NOT CONNECT TO A 3 PRONG WELDING RECEPTACLE it will cause damage.
Good Luck,
Bill2019 GMC 3500 SRW Sierra Denali Duramax
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03-13-2022, 11:04 AM #33
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It isn't, it's a 3 pin, 250v outlet: NEMA 6-50R, 2-pole, 3-wire, grounding, rated 50A 240V No Neutral
My garage welder outlet consists of two 30 amp breakers each feeding a 120 volt line providing a total of 220 volts for a total of 60 amps maximum. When I connect my 50 amp trailer "dogbone" to my 220 volt welding outlet in my garage, I'm actually only connecting to one of the 120 volt lines of the 220 volt outlet. I can run anything in the trailer, but I am limited to the 30 amp breaker on that 120 volt line I'm using. Therefore; if my trailer draws more than 30 amps it will trip the breaker in the garage. Therefore, I can not run both air conditioners in the trailer at the same time; I can't run the air conditioner and the microwave at the same time. I have to manage my power consumption.
DustinDustin and Doris
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03-13-2022, 11:10 AM #34
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What you are doing is unsafe, and may be a huge fire risk depending on the wiring.
You are drawing current through the EGC, which is a huge code and safety violation. You may also be significantly overloading the EGC since is is often smaller than the current carrying conductors on a circuit. The EGC MAY not be large enough to handle 30A.
There is no good way to operate a 120V device on a 240V circuit that doesn’t have a neutral.John & Kathy
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03-13-2022, 12:25 PM #35
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You're correct, there's no good, code approved way to do this. In my situation, the electrician who wired my garage/house (before I moved in) pulled 4 strand, 10 gauge wire. He connect both the neutral (white) and ground (bare) to the welding receptacle ground pin AND connected both the neutral (white) and ground (bare) to the neutral buss (white) in the breaker panel. So basically, because they are in parallel, they become a 6 gauge wire. And the welding outlet is basically "self bonded". Regardless, the ground and neutral buss bars in the breaker panel (in the house) are bonded anyway so it works for me because I understand and the EGC is not overloaded. But, it's not to code when I connect my trailer for loading and unloading and if an electrical short to chassis in appliance occurred in my trailer I'm counting on at least one of the many circuit breakers in the path to trip. We all make that assumption all the time with electrical appliances. I could also bond it in the RV electrical panel, but then I'd have to bond when I'm at home and unbond when I'm traveling and it's not worth the exercise.
There were suggestions to the OP to replace the welding receptacle (NEMA 6-50R) with an RV 50 amp receptacle, (NEMA 14-50R) but that would only work properly if there was 4 strand wire already pulled when the house/garage was wired. In my case, I could actually add a NEMA 14-50R outlet next to my welding outlet, and jumper it over to my welding receptacle, I guess. I use my welder fairly often so I'm not going to replace the outlet but I'll consider adding the RV receptacle...... actually no; if I did that then I'd have to purchase another 50 feet of RV, 50 amp power cord to extend all the way to the welding receptacle at the back of my garage. So, I don't need to fix what's already working.
This is a very hot topic and a serious safety issue if not really understood. And there are going to be more "opinions" about how/can/should I do this than "what's the best": air compressor, generator, or weight distribution hitch.
So, my advise is, if you don't understand what's going on then learn before you try.
On two occasions I've gone to friends houses that had wiring done by "electricians" that were wired incorrectly. On three occasions I've stayed in RV parks that have wiring problems in the pedestal (which is why I use the Hughes Bulldog RV Power Watchdog). It's too important to take for granted. The solution is to "seek to understand" don't just ask for opinions.
DustinLast edited by toolman.dustin; 03-13-2022 at 12:28 PM. Reason: spelling correction
Dustin and Doris
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03-13-2022, 03:32 PM #36
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03-13-2022, 03:57 PM #37
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Sure you can do that, but you have to understand how to wire the adapter to make it happen.
With the welder outlet you will have to verify it's a 250v outlet 3 prong common for dryers (use a meter to verify this), this will have the 2 hot lines (red and black) connected to the blades and the ground (green) connected to the gumdrop looking one.
The adapter you need to have made takes the red and black lines and connects them to the outsides blades of the 50A RV and then the green line get's bridged between the gumdrop blade and the straight blade directly across from it (mean for the white). It's not the ideal solutions but it works , the ground isn't usually the same gauge as the neutral and could have the potential to cause fire issues over longer runs and high amp draws, and when you mention it you stir up everything and get tensions running kinda like talking politics or something.
Anyway yeah you can do it, you'll just need to have an adapter made as mentioned before you can't buy that but the big box hardware will have what you need.
We all have risks that we accept driving down the road pulling a camper is one of them but we overcome.The only thing that works on a RV is the owner...
Jared - 315RLTS - 2500HD
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03-13-2022, 10:00 PM #38
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PLEASE DON'T DO what toolman.dustin or jungleb0y have done... you could end up getting someone killed!
This diagram is so unsafe it's not even funny.
I'm a retired electrician with 40+ years in all aspects of the trade and trust me when I tell you that neither of these are good remedies for your situation! If there is no 4 wire 50A cable at the welding receptacle there is no SAFE way to do it.... especially for non trained personel. You would be better off to switch everything you can over to gas and just run your RV on a 20A 120V dedicated line and only use the bare minimum in your RV.
If you look at the jacket on the cable feeding the welder outlet it will tell you what wires are in it. If by chance there are 4 wires there with 3 of them being insulated #6AWG and the 4th being a bare or green ground then it can safely be changed out to a 50A RV receptacle by a qualified person. The opposite end in the residential electrical panel would also need to be checked to verify everything is terminated correctly.Bill & Colleen ~ Schwenksville, Pa
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03-13-2022, 11:38 PM #39
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Here's one of them things on amazon that will get ya killed, better use with caution!!
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B09P1BP4ZQ...NsaWNrPXRydWU=The only thing that works on a RV is the owner...
Jared - 315RLTS - 2500HD
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03-14-2022, 03:54 AM #40
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And I still wouldn't use it for an RV with a 50A. power cord setup. The ground on a straight 250V dryer receptacle is not sized to handle the load requirements of an RV with 50A power.
Can you please show me the UL listing on it?
How about the CSA listings on it?
In case anyone doesn't understand UL listings....
Bill & Colleen ~ Schwenksville, Pa
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