Front frame flex - sorry for the re-hash

[ajg617]

I know I've seen pictures of this on either a YT video or another forum, but decal wrinkles in the area shown in the picture were prominent on where ever I had seen the flex issue (and it was a Solitude). Turned out frame bolts were missing as identified at GD Elkhart. These wrinkles were never apparent until recently and I only noticed them today. We have had flex concerns from day one (broken filon screws, screws falling out in closet area, repeatedly adjusting closet doors that won't open when leveled, goosebox manifolds blowing out, misaligned pass thru door). Saw this today and thought I'd put a picture up. Front frame flex is on the agenda for our factory repair visit in mid-April. Dealer was supposed to drop filon last year - they didn't but said they did. LCI said the measurements the dealer provided were garbage.



:42 in this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvXpA9xBpOc&t=0s and 4:09 in this video is what got me looking today at the decal. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctQ4K5ZoEik

 

[LMagelitz]

Would have liked to have seen the footage of his repair, but they didn’t want him posting it. Sounds like they did right by him, so you should be in good shape as well.

 

[Chaps2018]

I had a similar issue (screws loose, pinbox flex, etc) on a non-Grand Design rig. I opened a case with Lippert provided detailed measurements they said the frame was ok.

I looked for a dealer in the Houston area to look at the problem and was unable to find a repair facility who instilled confidence.

I ended up taking it to https://kansasrvcenter.com. I described the problem via email and they had seen it before. They had the rig for 6 days, found the aluminum wall frame around the master bed slide had broken also the frame (Lippert frame) brace near the drivers side propane tank was broken.

In order to do the repair, they had to remove the front cap and part of the exterior fiberglass on the sidewall.

My first choice would be to take it back to the factory if at all possible but these guys were very capable with a major repair like this.

 

[ajg617]

Would have liked to have seen the footage of his repair, but they didn’t want him posting it. Sounds like they did right by him, so you should be in good shape as well.

That would have been an interesting film - I might ask to do the same even if it is only for personal consumption. They dealt with the same senior CS rep that has been supporting us so I'm optimistic. I'm also committed to MORRyde IS but want to wait to book until GD techs go through the 310. I believe what I will do is move my dashcam to the rear window of the truck and film the wing/pinbox movement while driving from NH to IN.

 

[LMagelitz]

That would have been an interesting film - I might ask to do the same even if it is only for personal consumption. They dealt with the same senior CS rep that has been supporting us so I'm optimistic. I'm also committed to MORRyde IS but want to wait to book until GD techs go through the 310. I believe what I will do is move my dashcam to the rear window of the truck and film the wing/pinbox movement while driving from NH to IN.

Can you see anything cracked or broken in the front genny compartment, or in either propane tank area?

 

[ajg617]

Can you see anything cracked or broken in the front genny compartment, or in either propane tank area?

I haven't so far in the genny compartment, though the propane tank strap bolts keep breaking on the door side (opposite side from decal wrinkles) - had them replaced three times now. Once the snow melts a bit, I'm going to look a little harder in all of those areas. Meanwhile, GD has it on their radar for April visit.

 

[Chaps2018]

When I got mine in the shop and unhitched the guys took a fork lift truck and raised the inbox and the flex was painfully obvious (pin box moving relative to the front cap).

 

[LMagelitz]

I had a similar issue (screws loose, pinbox flex, etc) on a non-Grand Design rig. I opened a case with Lippert provided detailed measurements they said the frame was ok.

I looked for a dealer in the Houston area to look at the problem and was unable to find a repair facility who instilled confidence.

I ended up taking it to https://kansasrvcenter.com. I described the problem via email and they had seen it before. They had the rig for 6 days, found the aluminum wall frame around the master bed slide had broken also the frame (Lippert frame) brace near the drivers side propane tank was broken.

In order to do the repair, they had to remove the front cap and part of the exterior fiberglass on the sidewall.

My first choice would be to take it back to the factory if at all possible but these guys were very capable with a major repair like this.

There is a YouTube couple that had the same thing happen on a Van Leigh Beacon. Not sure where they had it fixed.

 

[ajg617]

When I got mine in the shop and unhitched the guys took a fork lift truck and raised the inbox and the flex was painfully obvious (pin box moving relative to the front cap).

I wonder what the limits of flex are? Did they make repairs on your rig?

 

[Chaps2018]

Re: limits of flex, I didn’t realize there are two areas that may/may not contribute to this. The first is the frame—In my case the frame checked out good (upper deck flex measurement worksheet)…you may recall we had this detailed discussion here: https://www.mygrandrv.com/forum/showthread.php/51422-Upper-Deck-Flex-Measurement-on-Momentum-398M

The second source of flex comes from the tralier “box” sitting on the frame. There is no spec that I am aware of for this. I expect the “box” to move with the frame as one member. In my case there was a frame weld broken (near propane tank) but the real cause of my flexing was the break in the aluminum structure of the “box” near the bedroom slide. You could not see the frame was broken until the fiberglass siding was removed in front of the bedroom slide. The full set of symptoms are listed in the above posting.

Yes, the Kansas RV Repair center did the work. They had the fiberglass, frame welders, box frameing expertise all in house.

Again i would iterate, returning to the factory is still the best repair path if possible IMHO.

 

[ajg617]

Snow finally cleared and got inside to start cleaning for trip to Elkhart Thursday. Sorry I did. I simply can not explain the amount of trim issues that occurred over the winter with the unit level and still showing level. From front cap to rear wall, it's insane - trim panels popped everywhere, daylight coming in on the rear wall where there never was before. But yet again, I could not open the bedroom closet doors despite the fact that they worked fine when leveled in the fall. Then I spotted a couple of screws in the closet shoe area that were sitting 1/4" above where they should have been secured. Off-door side (which is where most of the other flex symptoms are) was much worse than the door side. I verified that the lag bolts under the dresser were in place - did not want to take the wood trim off on the off-door side though much of it has popped loose around the bed frame. But gaps between ceiling and trim are now very noticeable. My confidence level about safely arriving in Elkhart is not high. Two pictures from today now added to the below list sent to GD.

1) Within 1500 miles all door side lower filon trim screws suddenly snapped letting the filon flap in the breeze
2) Shower soap dish screws snapped at approximately 2500 miles
3) Master control panel shattered in 4 locations in three months of delivery
4) Goosebox pressure relieve valve (new design) exploded pulling out of a fuel stop at about 11,000 miles
5) Goosebox pressure relief valve (original design) exploded pulling into a site at 18,000 miles
6) Decal wrinkles at dropdown frame site on off-door side at 19,000 miles
7) Suspension failures may or may not be related
8) Screws holding the passenger side propane tank strap continue to snap
9) Screws appearing on floor between closet and bed on a recurring basis - not sure but think they are coming from the closet door channels
10) Impossible to keep closet doors sliding smoothly - adjusted multiple time a year because I can't close them
11) Pass thru door no longer aligned properly allowing water onto the level-up controller
12) Replaced front cargo door warped again and difficult to lock
13) Despite W/D appears to be mounted to the floor but it continually moves during travel – I can move it just a little to even it out again, but it seems to slide each trip
14) Filon trim seal detaching on door off-side
15) Bulge from frame in filon at drop down of off-door side where the silicone sealant pulled away.


Notice two screws on off-door side and only one on door side.

 

[WhittleBurner]

Snow finally cleared and got inside to start cleaning for trip to Elkhart Thursday. Sorry I did. I simply can not explain the amount of trim issues that occurred over the winter with the unit level and still showing level. From front cap to rear wall, it's insane - trim panels popped everywhere, daylight coming in on the rear wall where there never was before. But yet again, I could not open the bedroom closet doors despite the fact that they worked fine when leveled in the fall. Then I spotted a couple of screws in the closet shoe area that were sitting 1/4" above where they should have been secured. Off-door side (which is where most of the other flex symptoms are) was much worse than the door side. I verified that the lag bolts under the dresser were in place - did not want to take the wood trim off on the off-door side though much of it has popped loose around the bed frame. But gaps between ceiling and trim are now very noticeable. My confidence level about safely arriving in Elkhart is not high. Two pictures from today now added to the below list sent to GD.

1) Within 1500 miles all door side lower filon trim screws suddenly snapped letting the filon flap in the breeze
2) Shower soap dish screws snapped at approximately 2500 miles
3) Master control panel shattered in 4 locations in three months of delivery
4) Goosebox pressure relieve valve (new design) exploded pulling out of a fuel stop at about 11,000 miles
5) Goosebox pressure relief valve (original design) exploded pulling into a site at 18,000 miles
6) Decal wrinkles at dropdown frame site on off-door side at 19,000 miles
7) Suspension failures may or may not be related
8) Screws holding the passenger side propane tank strap continue to snap
9) Screws appearing on floor between closet and bed on a recurring basis - not sure but think they are coming from the closet door channels
10) Impossible to keep closet doors sliding smoothly - adjusted multiple time a year because I can't close them
11) Pass thru door no longer aligned properly allowing water onto the level-up controller
12) Replaced front cargo door warped again and difficult to lock
13) Despite W/D appears to be mounted to the floor but it continually moves during travel – I can move it just a little to even it out again, but it seems to slide each trip
14) Filon trim seal detaching on door off-side
15) Bulge from frame in filon at drop down of off-door side where the silicone sealant pulled away.


Notice two screws on off-door side and only one on door side.
View attachment 50438View attachment 50439

You could request that they come and pick it up and emphasize the new findings with pictures. They have picked up others for repair. I would be scared to take it too

 

[ajg617]

You could request that they come and pick it up and emphasize the new findings with pictures. They have picked up others for repair. I would be scared to take it too

Well, they didn't offer that as an option and I'll go slow - three travel days out. But I put a line on the pin box and when I hitch up I'll see how much it moves. Too much and I'll unload the trailer and request they pick it up. Just finished loading it except for clothes etc. Oh, and while sanitizing the fresh water system, I kept seeing birds fly out from underneath every time I came near it - nest in the back of the Goosebox. No eggs and just started, so cleaned out. All in the family I guess.

 

[WhittleBurner]

Rather have birds than rats or squirrels ! Be safe and let us all know that you arrived in one piece.

 

[ajg617]

Rather have birds than rats or squirrels ! Be safe and let us all know that you arrived in one piece.

Made it to Middlebury but yikes. See post #9 at link below for gory details.

https://www.mygrandrv.com/forum/sho...ion-on-rotors-over-winter?p=522311#post522311