Making the jump to a (much) bigger camper.

[NDCamper]

Hi everyone. My wife and I have been Grand Design owners, Imagine 2150RB, for about three years now. We really like the quality, service, and are seriously considering making the transition to a much larger camper as we near retirement in about 3 years. We really like the floor plan of the Solitude 390rk, although haven't walked through one yet; we hope to do that soon. I have two questions.

1) I'm a bit nervous about making the transition from a TT that is just under 28 feet to a 5th wheel that is just over 41 feet. Those of you that made the jump from a relatively small TT to a large 5th wheel, how did you go about doing it. It's not like taking a test drive with a class A or C when you can get it on the road and decide if you can/can't handle it. I'm looking at investing in a larger TV and camper, which is quite an investment to make without knowing for sure that I'm ready for the jump.

2) now for my second question. After doing my research, I believe I'll need a DRW for a trailer this size. I was at a sport show this past weekend. There were no Grand Design's there but I did see an Alliance Paradigm that was close to size/weight so I had a lengthly conversation with the sales person about the appropriate TV for the Paradigm. He was adamant that a DRW TV wasn't needed and specifically said that DRW's are hard on campers because the ride is so stiff, there is no forgiveness in the suspension, and that campers will start to develop stress fractures/cracks in some key areas as a result. I asked if this was specific to the Paradigm and he said no, any brand will have that issue. Those of you that have larger campers and DRW TV's have you experienced damage to your camper as a result of having a DRW TV?

Thanks in advance for sharing your thoughts.

FWIW my wife is very impressed with the Paradigm, the storage space, design/colors, no carpet not to mention a few other things she saw. I reminded her that it's only the second year they've made campers so it's difficult to tell how they'll hold up.

 

[Ynot4me2]

I can't really help you out but boy, that will be one huge change of scenery. Good for you and good luck.

Sent from my SM-P610 using Tapatalk

 

[GeoffnCheri]

The 390RK has a gvwr of over 16K. That is dual wheel territory in my book

 

[NDCamper]

The 390RK has a gvwr of over 16K. That is duel wheel territory in my book

Mine too. I'm thinking a F450. I was surprised when the sales person was telling me that the DRW caused stress fractures/cracks. I've been reading this forum for three years, since we purchased our Imagine and I don't recall ever reading anything about stress fractures/cracks.

 

[Bungy]

I think the salesman was blowing smoke up your you-know-what!

 

[zinman]

Hi everyone. My wife and I have been Grand Design owners, Imagine 2150RB, for about three years now. We really like the quality, service, and are seriously considering making the transition to a much larger camper as we near retirement in about 3 years. We really like the floor plan of the Solitude 390rk, although haven't walked through one yet; we hope to do that soon. I have two questions.

1) I'm a bit nervous about making the transition from a TT that is just under 28 feet to a 5th wheel that is just over 41 feet. Those of you that made the jump from a relatively small TT to a large 5th wheel, how did you go about doing it. It's not like taking a test drive with a class A or C when you can get it on the road and decide if you can/can't handle it. I'm looking at investing in a larger TV and camper, which is quite an investment to make without knowing for sure that I'm ready for the jump.

2) now for my second question. After doing my research, I believe I'll need a DRW for a trailer this size. I was at a sport show this past weekend. There were no Grand Design's there but I did see an Alliance Paradigm that was close to size/weight so I had a lengthly conversation with the sales person about the appropriate TV for the Paradigm. He was adamant that a DRW TV wasn't needed and specifically said that DRW's are hard on campers because the ride is so stiff, there is no forgiveness in the suspension, and that campers will start to develop stress fractures/cracks in some key areas as a result. I asked if this was specific to the Paradigm and he said no, any brand will have that issue. Those of you that have larger campers and DRW TV's have you experienced damage to your camper as a result of having a DRW TV?

Thanks in advance for sharing your thoughts.

FWIW my wife is very impressed with the Paradigm, the storage space, design/colors, no carpet not to mention a few other things she saw. I reminded her that it's only the second year they've made campers so it's difficult to tell how they'll hold up.

[MENTION=25010]Rene L[/MENTION] I have the 2017 F350 CC SB with the heavy duty tow package and I would say I am near my limits when fully loaded (well,,,, I know I am I did the CAT scales). You may get away with the desired 5th wheel with a properly setup single rear wheel long bed with heavy duty tow package but your towing comfort level may be happier with the dually F350/450. The must do is to run the numbers on the tow rig of choice and 5th wheel of choice. Always keep towing safety your first priority. Lastly, we went from a 37 ft 5th wheel to a 41 and totally appreciate the extra room. Wife loves the dual vanity and walk in closet in our current unit. Do keep us posted on your choice. Always interesting to hear how you came to your decision. Safe Travels!!

 

[triplethreat]

Mine too. I'm thinking a F450. I was surprised when the sales person was telling me that the DRW caused stress fractures/cracks. I've been reading this forum for three years, since we purchased our Imagine and I don't recall ever reading anything about stress fractures/cracks.

As most of us know, the very last choice for ANY kind of advice about safely towing a camping trailer.....a salesman! 99.9% of them are driven by $$$ and how they make their living selling their products. You've come to the right place for advice. Personally, I would never consider towing a trailer that large without a Dually. Are there SRW trucks that might/could possibly do the job.....the short answer is barely yes. Many of the 2020 and newer 1 Ton trucks have increased their GVWR, and thus the payload capacity. Some of those will be in the 4200-4400 lb payload range and might suffice for the 390RK.

Having said that, it is ALWAYS wise to calculate for "worst case scenario" numbers. That involves taking the GVWR of the trailer, which in the case of the 390RK is 16,800 lbs and do the 20% to 25% pin weight calculation. 20% would equal...3360 lbs of pin. 25% would equal...4200 lbs of pin. Obviously, it will depend on how heavy you load the trailer, where the stuff is stored, etc. So where does that leave you with a towing vehicle choice? In my opinion, it leaves you with only one real choice.....Chevy, GMC, Ford, Ram.....Dually trucks! As has been stated many, many times before on this and many other forums, PAYLOAD numbers are the Most Important numbers to look at when choosing a 5th Wheel Camping trailer, as you will run out of that, long before you do towing capacity.

And as far as going from a TT to a 5ver..AND going much bigger, there is definitely a learning curve to that. In my case, I went from a 34' tow behind to a 44' 5ver and just gained about 2' of overall length to my rig. Since the 5ver is attached in the bed of the truck, vs. being attached behind the truck, the overall length of the longer trailer is somewhat negated by where the 5ver is attached to the truck. I made the transition in a very short period of time, as most people do, and I have to say that I'm very happy with the new trailer. Hope this helps and good luck with you new adventure.

 

[WhittleBurner]

We really like the floor plan of the Solitude 390rk, although haven't walked through one yet; we hope to do that soon. I have two questions.

We went through the 390 and was thinking I would feel cramped in the kitchen with the island. Suprisingly the kitchen has more room than it looked like there would be walking around the island in pictures. Most of the storage is in the rear kitchen, almost no storage in the livingroom area. Then of course storage in the bedroom. The huge basement is nice but payload is measley compared to the room for stuff. The upgraded axles and tires for this floorplan is a must unless you're going to be a weekend warrior.
Hopefully they fixed the issue of not being able to open the fridge door all they way. There was no way to remove the crisper drawers on the left because the fridge was placed in the very end of the rear wall. Walked in thinking no, then walked away really liking this floor plan

Definately a 450 dually if this were going to be our rig

 

[NDCamper]

We went through the 390 and was thinking I would feel cramped in the kitchen with the island. Suprisingly the kitchen has more room than it looked like there would be walking around the island in pictures. Most of the storage is in the rear kitchen, almost no storage in the livingroom area. Then of course storage in the bedroom. The huge basement is nice but payload is measley compared to the room for stuff. The upgraded axles and tires for this floorplan is a must unless you're going to be a weekend warrior.
Hopefully they fixed the issue of not being able to open the fridge door all they way. There was no way to remove the crisper drawers on the left because the fridge was placed in the very end of the rear wall. Walked in thinking no, then walked away really liking this floor plan

Definately a 450 dually if this were going to be our rig

Thanks for the input floorplan and what to look for when we do a walk through. I really appreciate it.

 

[NDCamper]

As most of us know, the very last choice for ANY kind of advice about safely towing a camping trailer.....a salesman! 99.9% of them are driven by $$$ and how they make their living selling their products. You've come to the right place for advice. Personally, I would never consider towing a trailer that large without a Dually. Are there SRW trucks that might/could possibly do the job.....the short answer is barely yes. Many of the 2020 and newer 1 Ton trucks have increased their GVWR, and thus the payload capacity. Some of those will be in the 4200-4400 lb payload range and might suffice for the 390RK.

I completely agree about getting TV advice from a camper sales person. What I found odd is that I told him I thought I needed a DRW, and that's when he started telling me not to do it because of the problems it causes. I'm convinced I need a DRW for the camper we're looking at I was just looking to confirm if anyone with a DRW experienced cracks/stress fractures because of an unforgiving suspension.

No one that has replied as mentioned cracks/stress fractures, so I think my hunch is correct that it's not a real thing OR it's very, very isolated.

Thanks for the insight.

René

 

[orbsah]

Yes, DRW as mentioned above!

I didn't care for the 390RK floorplan partly because of this: We do most of our cooking outside and are constantly shuttling food, kitchen items back/forth thru the entry door. I think it's nice to have the kitchen by the door which is one reason why a 375RES is likely our next rig (with 8K axles).

 

[NDCamper]

Yes, DRW as mentioned above!

I didn't care for the 390RK floorplan partly because of this: We do most of our cooking outside and are constantly shuttling food, kitchen items back/forth thru the entry door. I think it's nice to have the kitchen by the door which is one reason why a 375RES is likely our next rig (with 8K axles).

Great advice. I too do most of the cooking outside. Yes on the 8K axles.

René

 

[triplethreat]

Great advice. I too do most of the cooking outside. Yes on the 8K axles.

René

Here's the thing about a Dually for that trailer. You are likely going to have at a minimum....somewhere north of 3500 lb of pin weight from that trailer on the truck. Then the hitch and anything else that goes in/on the truck.....passenger(s), maybe extra fuel for the truck, firewood, ect. I could see pretty easily over 4000 lbs of weight in/on the truck. The Dually payload is likely going to be in the 5200 to 5400 lbs, so realistically, the truck isn't going to go down the road like a solid/no suspension/hard tail type thing. With that much weight, bumps will cause the truck to act like any other truck. The saleman really doesn't have a clue what he's talking about.

 

[GeoffnCheri]

No one that has replied as mentioned cracks/stress fractures, so I think my hunch is correct that it's not a real thing OR it's very, very isolated.

Thanks for the insight.

René

In all of our research and having friends who have dually trucks, I cannot say it's not a real thing. I can say in my 59 years, this is the first time I have ever heard such a thing from anyone, much less reportedly from a salesperson.

 

[Dawgfever]

Just be sure you account for the 50 lbs of stuff you add and the 1000 lbs your wife adds ��

Also, be patient learning to back it up. Don’t do like a fellow I know. Went out and bought a truck and 40’+ 5’vr. Went camping with a group of us and spent an hour trying to back it in a tight campsite. Got mad went home and bought a Class A. In fact, as I am typing this, I remember that last Memorial Day we saw a couple with a new 5vr do the exact same thing. Gave up and returned the next day in a Class A.

Hmmm, maybe that’s how you sell Class A....sell’em a 5vr first.

Ed

 

[triplethreat]

Backing a trailer in, like anything else requires some practice and patience when learning how to do it. Some of us have been doing it for years and years and years (yea, I'm an old guy). But even as experienced as I was when I bought my first 5ver (44' long overall), I still went through a learning curve before I became mostly comfortable with it. Having good spotters with a communications device like a phone or two way radio is invaluable, as is taking it slow and easy.....no matter who is waiting for you to clear out of the way so that they can get by you.

 

[Dawgfever]

Ditto on xrated’s post. Practice, patience, listen only to your wife or whoever is guiding you. My boss puts the cell phone on speaker and then under her bra strap. That leaves her hands free for whatever signal she feels appropriate for the moment. And...don’t worry about the line waiting on you. Traffic will be waiting on them when it is their turn.

Ed

 

[DragonDriver]

Hi everyone. I have ... questions.

1) I'm a bit nervous about making the transition from a TT that is just under 28 feet to a 5th wheel that is just over 41 feet. Those of you that made the jump from a relatively small TT to a large 5th wheel, how did you go about doing it. It's not like taking a test drive with a class A or C when you can get it on the road and decide if you can/can't handle it. I'm looking at investing in a larger TV and camper, which is quite an investment to make without knowing for sure that I'm ready for the jump.
...

If it's any help, remember that a 41 foot 5er will actually tail back around 38 feet because it overhangs the bed of the truck by that much. That view can be a little intimidating for someone who's used to hauling a TT.

As a former TT dragger myself, one other thing you'll need to get used to is the path the 5er will take when towing. The trailer follows the hitch ball, so a TT will pretty much follow along in the same path as the towing vehicle. However, when you move the ball into the bed of the truck the 5er will seem to make the cut a lot sharper. When making those right-hand turns I've learned to pull well out in the road before I cut the wheel. Otherwise I tend to take out anything that may be on on the corner ... like the police vehicle at the DMV where I went to register my trailer. (insert heart-felt, heavy sigh right about here)

 

[mbergthold]

Hi everyone. My wife and I have been Grand Design owners, Imagine 2150RB, for about three years now. We really like the quality, service, and are seriously considering making the transition to a much larger camper as we near retirement in about 3 years. We really like the floor plan of the Solitude 390rk, although haven't walked through one yet; we hope to do that soon. I have two questions.

1) I'm a bit nervous about making the transition from a TT that is just under 28 feet to a 5th wheel that is just over 41 feet. Those of you that made the jump from a relatively small TT to a large 5th wheel, how did you go about doing it. It's not like taking a test drive with a class A or C when you can get it on the road and decide if you can/can't handle it. I'm looking at investing in a larger TV and camper, which is quite an investment to make without knowing for sure that I'm ready for the jump. .

My experience, having had a small 5th, a 28' Prowler, a 40' Weekend Warrior Toyhauler, 25' Nash, and now an Imagine 2500RL, is that unless you have a zero sway hitch like the Hensley Arrow, you'll prefer the 41' 5th. Our 40' was a triple axle, I've done a pivet u-turn in a cul-de-sac with it, driven in all sorts of weather, at speeds up to 75 (Nevada), and frankly if I didn't have to give up the truck bed, we'd have another 5th now. A rear-view camera would've been nice to have on the WW for passing slower vehicles, but I did fine w/o it. Remember that part of that 41' is over the truck bed and the space used by the hitch and tongue of your bumper pull, so it's not really that much longer than your 2150.

 

[triplethreat]

My experience, having had a small 5th, a 28' Prowler, a 40' Weekend Warrior Toyhauler, 25' Nash, and now an Imagine 2500RL, is that unless you have a zero sway hitch like the Hensley Arrow, you'll prefer the 41' 5th. Our 40' was a triple axle, I've done a pivet u-turn in a cul-de-sac with it, driven in all sorts of weather, at speeds up to 75 (Nevada), and frankly if I didn't have to give up the truck bed, we'd have another 5th now. A rear-view camera would've been nice to have on the WW for passing slower vehicles, but I did fine w/o it. Remember that part of that 41' is over the truck bed and the space used by the hitch and tongue of your bumper pull, so it's not really that much longer than your 2150.View attachment 32321

Very true....I had a 34 1/2' tow behind trailer and using my CrewCab Dually, my overall length was 59 1/2'. When I went to a 5th Wheel trailer that is ~44' long, my overall length went to ~60 1/2'....so I gained around a foot or so.