Two issues regarding my LiFePO4 battery swap

JLA956

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Texas
About three weeks ago, I swapped out my trailer's 100aH lead-acid battery for a 100aH LiFePO4. My trailer is a 2023 Imagine 2970RL, and it has a WFCO 55 AMP Auto Detect converter (WF-9855-AD) along with a Furrion 25 AMP Solar Charger (FSCC30PSW-BL).

Issue #1 - after I installed the new lithium battery, I switched the solar charge controller to the lithium mode by following the instructions in the manual. It initially stays in the lithium mode, but overnight, it switches over to the "sealed" mode. I then switch it back to lithium, and it stays that way during the daytime, but in the morning, it has again switched back to the "sealed" battery mode. It does this every day. Any suggestions or ideas on how to get it to stay in the "lithium" mode would be appreciated.

Issue #2 - My trailer has a continual parasitic drain of about .30 amps when not in use, so the converter should always be charging the battery. Up until about five days ago, the WFCO converter would keep the battery fully charged according to the Furrion Battery monitor. I happened to open the bay to get something out and noticed that the Furrion Battery Monitor showed that the battery was down to about a 70% charge level and that no charge was coming in. I went and checked my panel box to see if a breaker had somehow flipped, but all was good. I then flipped off the breaker for about five minutes and then turned it back on, and the battery monitor then showed power coming in and charging the battery. When I checked it the next morning, the battery was fully charged. One day later, I checked it again, and no power was going in, and the battery was down to about 90%. Any ideas as to why the converter is not working properly? (note - I recalibrated the battery monitor after I installed the new battery)
TIA for your help.
 
Both the Furrion controller and the WFCO AD converter have “bugs” that cause the behavior you are seeing.

Call Lippert with your controller serial number and information. They may offer a fix, which is a replacement.

Similarly with WFCO. They can set the converter to stay in LiFePO mode. Call them.
 
About three weeks ago, I swapped out my trailer's 100aH lead-acid battery for a 100aH LiFePO4. My trailer is a 2023 Imagine 2970RL, and it has a WFCO 55 AMP Auto Detect converter (WF-9855-AD) along with a Furrion 25 AMP Solar Charger (FSCC30PSW-BL).
Issue #1 - after I installed the new lithium battery, I switched the solar charge controller to the lithium mode by following the instructions in the manual. It initially stays in the lithium mode, but overnight, it switches over to the "sealed" mode. I then switch it back to lithium, and it stays that way during the daytime, but in the morning, it has again switched back to the "sealed" battery mode. It does this every day. Any suggestions or ideas on how to get it to stay in the "lithium" mode would be appreciated.

Issue #2 - My trailer has a continual parasitic drain of about .30 amps when not in use, so the converter should always be charging the battery. Up until about five days ago, the WFCO converter would keep the battery fully charged according to the Furrion Battery monitor. I happened to open the bay to get something out and noticed that the Furrion Battery Monitor showed that the battery was down to about a 70% charge level and that no charge was coming in. I went and checked my panel box to see if a breaker had somehow flipped, but all was good. I then flipped off the breaker for about five minutes and then turned it back on, and the battery monitor then showed power coming in and charging the battery. When I checked it the next morning, the battery was fully charged. One day later, I checked it again, and no power was going in, and the battery was down to about 90%. Any ideas as to why the converter is not working properly? (note - I recalibrated the battery monitor after I installed the new battery)
TIA for your help.
Not and answer to either issue, but you may want to fully disconnect the battery cable or add a shut-off switch at battery, at least until Issue #2 is solved. You don't want to find the battery fully discharged. Going to 0 SOC for 5-15 days and BMS may not turn on again (not covered by warranty). On the other hand, forgetting to use the new full shut-off and not turning on 120AC will cause same problem.

It is better to not keep LFP batteries on a charge to increase the life. People do it, though, and choose to take the hit for valid reasons.
 
The Furrion controllers are known for that issue; it's happened to many on this forum. If it's still under warranty, you could contact GD customer support if no warranty try contacting Lippert directly. Many have switched to a Victron controller.

The WF-9855-AD on my coach does not stay in lithium mode. WFCO sent me a jumper to keep it in lithium mode, but I haven't installed it yet. If you contact WFCO and request the jumper, they'll probably send you one for free.
 
Both the Furrion controller and the WFCO AD converter have “bugs” that cause the behavior you are seeing.

Call Lippert with your controller serial number and information. They may offer a fix, which is a replacement.

Similarly with WFCO. They can set the converter to stay in LiFePO mode. Call them.

I contacted Lippert regarding the Solar Charger, and they confirmed that there is an issue that cannot be fixed so they're shipping me a new one at no charge. They said that the problem is that the charger goes dead once the sun goes down and does not recognize power from either the battery or the converter. I have reached out to WFCO about the converter and am awaiting their response.

Thanks for everyone's feedback!
 
Does anyone know what size (amps) this inline fuse on my '23 Imagine 2970RL is? The service techs at WFCO are asking, and I was hoping someone might know so that I won't have to go to the trouble of disconnecting all the wires and removing it. TIA for your help.
 

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Does anyone know what size (amps) this inline fuse on my '23 Imagine 2970RL is? The service techs at WFCO are asking, and I was hoping someone might know so that I won't have to go to the trouble of disconnecting all the wires and removing it. TIA for your help.
There should be some printing on the side or sides of it that would tell you the amp rating. If you have to see the backside, grab an inspection mirror and see if you can read it.
 
What voltage is the converter/charger reading? Since a lithium battery sits at a higher voltage than lead acid, and the converter isn't staying in lithium mode as it should, then it could be holding off charging until the battery drops below the level required to initiate the charge cycle for lead acid. Just a thought...
 
I purchased and installed a lithium battery and a WF-9875-AD. At first I found that the charge current was very low (10A) because the voltage drop from charger to battery was 0.6V so the charger was seeing a higher voltage than the battery actually was at so the charger would immediately drop out of bulk mode (charging mode) of 14.4V down to absorption at 13.6V and I was only getting 10A charging of the battery. To solve that issue, I moved the battery next to the converter and directly connected them. Now getting the full 75A charging. Once the battery reached 14.4V (the BMS in the battery would shut off charging at some point and the voltage would climb quickly) the converter would drop to 13.6V. If in lithium mode (I checked and the light is green, not blue indicating converter is still in lead acid mode) It should instead go to 14.6V and then drop to 13.6V and stay there. Unfortunately, it is still in lead acid mode so 48 hours after the start of the charge cycle, the converter drops to float mode at 13.2V. At that point, the battery voltage is higher than the converter voltage so the battery is being used to supply power to the coach until it drops to 13.2V so basically, it's discharging the battery to the point that it is at 13.2V. My temporary solution is to drain the battery, start the charging less than 48 Hours before I'm hitting the road so the converter doesn't have the required 48 Hour to drop into float mode. I have been in contact with WFCO on a warranty claim and they have agreed to install a jumper to force the converter to be in lithium mode constantly. Shipping it out next week and it would appear it will take 2-3 weeks.
 
I heard from one of the techs at WFCO about the auto-reset circuit breaker. After letting him know that it was a 30-amp breaker, he emailed me the following:

"You will want to bump that up to a 60-amp fuse. These fuses have been known to go bad and only allow power to pass through one way as well or cause a slow drain over time. Swapping out that fuse should solve the problem."

My question is, will I jeopardize anything by doubling the breaker capacity - especially my wiring?
 
No. Explaining why would take a bit, but the voltage across the wires is to low to have significant wattage heat to the wires.
 
In fact, I upgraded my converter to 75A and moved my battery to the converter to get the full 75A of charging so I changed my auto reset fuse to 90A.
 
There is another issue of which you should be aware.

When I converted my 2023 315RLTS to lithium batteries, I discovered there is a chip that must be soldered into the main fuse panel.

(I imagine it depends on the model of the fuse panel.)

I THINK it is a low-voltage detection chip, but I didn't install it, so I am not sure exactly what it does.


I called Battle Born to see if the mechanic was pulling my leg and the response was, "Sounds like he knows what he is doing."

I do know I had the same problems as you, until he installed the chip and all those troubles magically went away.
 
I purchased and installed a lithium battery and a WF-9875-AD. At first I found that the charge current was very low (10A) because the voltage drop from charger to battery was 0.6V so the charger was seeing a higher voltage than the battery actually was at so the charger would immediately drop out of bulk mode (charging mode) of 14.4V down to absorption at 13.6V and I was only getting 10A charging of the battery. To solve that issue, I moved the battery next to the converter and directly connected them. Now getting the full 75A charging. Once the battery reached 14.4V (the BMS in the battery would shut off charging at some point and the voltage would climb quickly) the converter would drop to 13.6V. If in lithium mode (I checked and the light is green, not blue indicating converter is still in lead acid mode) It should instead go to 14.6V and then drop to 13.6V and stay there. Unfortunately, it is still in lead acid mode so 48 hours after the start of the charge cycle, the converter drops to float mode at 13.2V. At that point, the battery voltage is higher than the converter voltage so the battery is being used to supply power to the coach until it drops to 13.2V so basically, it's discharging the battery to the point that it is at 13.2V. My temporary solution is to drain the battery, start the charging less than 48 Hours before I'm hitting the road so the converter doesn't have the required 48 Hour to drop into float mode. I have been in contact with WFCO on a warranty claim and they have agreed to install a jumper to force the converter to be in lithium mode constantly. Shipping it out next week and it would appear it will take 2-3 weeks.
After my trip the battery was below 50% SOC. When I hooked up to shore power, the charger went into lithium mode. I'm going to keep an eye on it to see if it stays there
 
Concerning the breaker, it should be there to protect the wiring from full battery current if there was a short to ground in the wiring that runs off the battery. If your wiring is no smaller than 10 awg, a 60 a fuse or breaker is fine. 90a, not so much unless the wiring is 6 awg.
 
Issue #2 - My trailer has a continual parasitic drain of about .30 amps when not in use, so the converter should always be charging the battery. Up until about five days ago, the WFCO converter would keep the battery fully charged according to the Furrion Battery monitor. I happened to open the bay to get something out and noticed that the Furrion Battery Monitor showed that the battery was down to about a 70% charge level and that no charge was coming in. I went and checked my panel box to see if a breaker had somehow flipped, but all was good. I then flipped off the breaker for about five minutes and then turned it back on, and the battery monitor then showed power coming in and charging the battery. When I checked it the next morning, the battery was fully charged. One day later, I checked it again, and no power was going in, and the battery was down to about 90%. Any ideas as to why the converter is not working properly? (note - I recalibrated the battery monitor after I installed the new battery)
TIA for your help.
Peer through the cracks of the converter cover and see if you see a blue or green LED. If it is green, the converter is not detecting and going into Lithium mode. Blue LED means it is in lithium mode.

Here's what happens with the converter in lead acid mode with a lithium battery. The converter will go to bulk charge mode and attempt to force 14.4V. If it takes more than 55A to get to that voltage, the converter will stop at the voltage required to force 55A. The voltage will slowly rise until it can reach 14.4V with 55A or less of charging. When the charge current drops to a preset level, the converter will drop its output to 13.6V also known as absorption mode. It will continue to force 13.6V for 48 hours after charging began. After 48 hours, it will drop to float mode of 13.2V. At that point in time, since the battery voltage is higher than the converter output voltage, the current draw from the trailer will be sourced by and drain the battery until the battery output is equivalent with the converter output of 13.2V. 13.2V for a Lithium battery is ~80% state of charge.

If properly in lithium mode it will attempt to force 14.6V (charge mode) and when charge current drops to a preset level, it will drop to 13.8V (power mode) and remain there and battery will not drain down.

Note: Charge/Bulk mode have a maximum time of 10 hours, so if your battery takes more than 10 hours to charge, you will have to unplug and replug the unit to get it back into charge/bulk mode and restart the 10 hour timer.

In order to get mine to go into Lithium mode, I had to drain my battery below 50% state of charge and then plug in.

Note: all of the above assumes you have the most current firmware installed in your converter which is V1.21A. The firmware version is on a sticker on top of the converter. If this is not the firmware your unit has, WFCO will take care of having it shipped back to them and updated.
 
Peer through the cracks of the converter cover and see if you see a blue or green LED. If it is green, the converter is not detecting and going into Lithium mode. Blue LED means it is in lithium mode.

Here's what happens with the converter in lead acid mode with a lithium battery. The converter will go to bulk charge mode and attempt to force 14.4V. If it takes more than 55A to get to that voltage, the converter will stop at the voltage required to force 55A. The voltage will slowly rise until it can reach 14.4V with 55A or less of charging. When the charge current drops to a preset level, the converter will drop its output to 13.6V also known as absorption mode. It will continue to force 13.6V for 48 hours after charging began. After 48 hours, it will drop to float mode of 13.2V. At that point in time, since the battery voltage is higher than the converter output voltage, the current draw from the trailer will be sourced by and drain the battery until the battery output is equivalent with the converter output of 13.2V. 13.2V for a Lithium battery is ~80% state of charge.

If properly in lithium mode it will attempt to force 14.6V (charge mode) and when charge current drops to a preset level, it will drop to 13.8V (power mode) and remain there and battery will not drain down.

Note: Charge/Bulk mode have a maximum time of 10 hours, so if your battery takes more than 10 hours to charge, you will have to unplug and replug the unit to get it back into charge/bulk mode and restart the 10 hour timer.

In order to get mine to go into Lithium mode, I had to drain my battery below 50% state of charge and then plug in.

Note: all of the above assumes you have the most current firmware installed in your converter which is V1.21A. The firmware version is on a sticker on top of the converter. If this is not the firmware your unit has, WFCO will take care of having it shipped back to them and updated.
Thanks for this info - I just replaced my auto-reset breaker with a larger size as the WFCO rep asked me to do. He instructed me to totally drain the battery down to zero and then plug in the shore power which should allow the converter to detect the lithium battery. I will do like you suggested and look at the color of the LED to make sure it's blue. I will also check what firmware my converter has.
 
I just took a picture of the top of my WFCO converter and am attaching it. There are two stickers at the bottom of the converter but I don't think that they show the firmware so I'm not sure where else to look. However, you can probably detect a greenish glow coming from the top of the converter so I guess that means it's not on lithium mode. Since the trailer is not plugged into shore power, I was surprised to see this lit up as I was assuming that it only would do so while in charging mode. Hopefully, when the battery fully discharges and the green LED goes out, it will turn blue when I plug it back in to shore power.
 

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